ME and sleeping

Hi Belinda,

I don't know the answer to that question, but just wanted to wish you good luck in finding the solution - and welcome to HP.

Venetian

Hi belle46

I don't think you can get melatonin here (UK). I know you can get it in supermarkets in the US as I did, as its good for jet lag - a friend of mine did get some but it may have been by mail order - have you done a search on google.
Sorry to hear of your ME.

Luv Binah
x

Hi belle46

I wish you all the best with your condition.

I recently read an article that stated Melatonin was banned in the UK and that it could affect your Hypothalamus (which in turn can impact the rest of your endocrine system). I thought that you may be interested in hearing this.

Having said this, I was under the impression that it had been prescribed to a friend of mine by a Specialist...perhaps it is legally available if prescribed?

Unrefreshing sleep is very debilitating. Sleep must be addressed in order to facilitate recovery from, or to manage ME/CFS. It may be in your interest to see your G.P. and ask for help, or an appropriate referral.

Regards
EJ

Thanks everyone for your comments. My GP in the UK gave me clonazepam which relaxes my muscles stopping them twitching but unfortunately does not relax my brain so although I may sleep it is unrefreshing and I have vivid dreams. My GP here in France has continued that treatment but is unresponsive to changing it. ME here is even less acknowledged than in the UK.

The only good thing is that the French are very into homeopathy and alternative therapies so I am busy researching what is available in my area. If anyone visits HP who also lives in France I would love to hear from them. I live in region 46.

Sorry to ramble on - it's good to talk!

Hello Belle,

You can get homoeopathic Melatonin from Martine Faure Alderson, who practices both here and in France. She has been in practice for over 30 years and I highly recommend her. .

If you need any further info on ME, (causes etc.,) then do pm me and I can send it across to you. I am away until the 27th.

Wishing you the very best

Candlelight

Hi Belle46.

I have had M.E. and still occasionally experience relapses.
I have also had deep depressions.

I live in Dept. 16 and you can PM me if you wish.
Sarah.

Thanks to Candlelight and Sarah for your suggestions, they are most helpful.

Belinda

Me And The Amalgam Connection

dear Belle

I had Me/ CFS for 24 years. I discovered that my cause was mercury poisoning from amalgam fillings. So if you have these then it will be worth while checking out on the internet for Andy Cutler - a bio chemist who has a book called Amalgam Illness Diagnosis and cure.
I like many others are followin his advice and getting better - though not without problems. It is not and easy or cheap road -though it may very well be the correct one.

Kind regards Robert UK

As fasr as my experience goes I treat clients for ME successfully. It is form of depression, hence the tears you get. Drugs will not help in the long term as there is an underlying cause that is emotional in nature. Try to find out if you have a analytical hypnotherapist in your area and have a word with them.

As fasr as my experience goes I treat clients for ME successfully. It is form of depression, hence the tears you get. Drugs will not help in the long term as there is an underlying cause that is emotional in nature. Try to find out if you have a analytical hypnotherapist in your area and have a word with them.

that is entirely wrong - ME is not a form of depression. it is classified as a neurological illness by the World Health Organisation -

As fasr as my experience goes I treat clients for ME successfully.

ME / post-viral fatigue syndrome can be hard to diagnose anyway; as I've posted elsewhere, it sounds to me as if, if there actually is success here, then you are really getting people with depression, not real ME, hence treatment for depression could work.

It is form of depression,

No it isn't, and that appears to be official (see Missy's post above).

hence the tears you get. Drugs will not help in the long term as there is an underlying cause that is emotional in nature.

I don't think many of us who have (or get bouts/periods of) ME / CFS take allopathic drugs for it. I've found they have zero effect anyway. In my case I wait for the physical symptoms (which is what they are) to go away, and I'm blessed that in my case they soon do, for long periods being absent. Then I'm instantly jolly again, just like anyone recovering from real flu or whatever.

V

Hiya
I am coming to this thread a little late, but you may find this site useful.
It may help you and others to understand a little about their condition and some of the factors, which were already mentioned in this thread.

Thanks, Gussie. I haven't had time to look over much of the site yet, but it looks good and interesting, and no doubt useful. The page on ME/CFS is as though some extremely accurate psychic were giving me a reading (for the periods when I do have ME, which usually I blessedly don't):

This'll be a useful site to keep up-to-date on developments.

Edit to add: This is all so familiar, from the page :

"People with CFIDS share many common symptoms, but not everyone has all the same ones. CFIDS often begins with an infectious flu-like disease accompanied by fevers that come and go. There is often accompanying joint stiffness and pain, sore throat, cough, sleep disturbances, light sensitivity, night sweats, and extreme exhaustion after the slightest exertion. It's common that a short walk or bit of exercise wipes out your energy for days afterward. Some people have the Epstein-Barr virus, or Cytomegalovirus, but others don't. Sometimes healthy people have high blood titers for these viruses and have no symptoms of CFIDS. It's possible that these viruses trigger CFIDS, but it's also possible that the low immune function in people with CFIDS increases their chances of catching a wide variety of infectious illnesses.

"Many people with CFIDS cannot hold down a job and many are depressed because the fatigue is so extreme. Those who do work come home exhausted and go immediately to bed so they can generate enough energy for work the next day. Because there isn't any apparent cause and no observable symptoms (like boils or measles), people with CFIDS are often confronted by people and doctors who just don't believe it's real."

There's then a long list of researchers' findings about physical changes and findings within ME/CFS suffering people.

V

that is entirely wrong - ME is not a form of depression. it is classified as a neurological illness by the World Health Organisation -

If that were true how xcan I help clients using analytical hypnotherapy?
The DSM book the 'bible' of psychology tells us shyness is a mental illness which is clap trap promoted by the drug companies. It wasn't so long ago that ME wasn't even believed in.
Personally I believe experience above convenient titles. when I see that doctors fail to treat the clients I see it makes me doubt such tags.

When faced with 'true believers' in some delusion, the belief can tend to be so ingrained that one can only back off and not waste one's time. (Delusions such as that a physical illness isn't real, since its physical cuases and symptoms are a little complex - see Gussie's link above - and it'll take time for the necessary research to 'come in'.)

I doubt that hypnotherapy itself can cure such religiously-held belief-systems when a mind is closed. No more than it 'xcan' aid bad grammar.

V

International Classification of Disease 10: G93.3.

catergoy

International Classification of Disease 10: G93.3.

I just looked up Missy's link, and as a disease it reads:

"G93.3 Postviral fatigue syndrome
Benign myalgic encephalomyelitis"

It's clearly accepted as being a physical disease, though of course we all have free will and anyone is free to disagree. But again, as someone with experience (that magic word from a post above) of ME, I can attest that it's physical, like the flu but 10x, yet largely (not quite wholly with me) without the mucous aspect.

So disagreeing that ME is physical is a bit like saying flu isn't a virus, or a broken arm is imaginary. Of course, all disease can be seen from a metaphysical slant, but usually that doesn't help to understand it or to heal it.

The main issue is 'political' - the 'politics' that have been involved over twenty years in getting ME accepted as something not 'in the mind'. It's hardly pleasant to be truly very ill, too physically ill to work, yet (as years ago at least) for others and employers, even medics, to suggest it was psychosomatic. We know it isn't.

V

Amazing site isn't it, full of practical and useful information, which isn't readily available elsewhere.

As an aside, have any of you read this?
Why Me? My Journey from M.E. to Health and Happiness (Paperback)

Amazing read, enlightening for sufferers and those who haven't alike.. it explains how devastating and how rapidly you can go into decline.. it takes minutes to crumble, I really did identify with that.

It is often poorly diagnosed, people just get missed in the system, unfortunately. Having treated a number of clients with this diagnosis, or who are struggling to get a diagnosis, you can see the symptoms and the spiralling down is often there, but by the time they reach anyone who can support them they have really fallen a long way.

I think that the discussion here highlights a very important point, that this disease is very misunderstood, some class it as neurological, others emotional. I know my own manifested itself physically but that there were emotional triggers, the clearing of elements of both of these were crucial in my own recovery, as the emotional impact was very much keeping me down and preventing my immune system from recovering. Bit of a catch 22 really, starts with one thng, affects the other, for many, but I would agree it's not an 'all in the head' illness - no way.

the emotional impact was very much keeping me down and preventing my immune system from recovering. Bit of a catch 22 really, starts with one thng, affects the other, for many, but I would agree it's not an 'all in the head' illness - no way.

LOL, excuse me for posting so much here, but obviously the thing has been an 'interesting' part of my life for a long time now. I can smile about it as I don't have it on this day and date. But it's interesting that you do identify an emotional trigger (sometimes?). That could, I can see, kick off a physical thing by hitting the immune system.

To repeat myself, in my own case, 'emotional trigger' b*****s :p. I could be on my way to play sport and really looking forward to it when - Wham. It might be a totally normal working day, and nothing at all unusual going on, when - Wham. I've very, very rarely noticed a trigger. At its worst, in early days, it was simply a regular thing like a female cycle, but for me it was eleven days off, then three days on.

If that's psychosomatic, go figure, LOL. What happens in a man's life every 14 days?? :confused::confused: Your local footie team losing instead of winning? :confused::p

V

Not saying it is psychosomatic, but I do know that during my treatment for it, it is the emotions I had surrounding the illness which hampered my recovery in many ways. Basically, I was fine in my head before it happened, but it was so physically debilitating that it ultimately affected my emotions. The physical, in my opinion, always comes first, but you cannot suffer an illness like ME / CFS without it ultimately affecting how you feel later on in some shape or form.

For me, my own fear of relapse (and I have noted this in others) has greatly held them back and can be an unhealthy preoccupation, the immune system has enough to deal ith already.

Hi Lookintomyeyes

You wrote:

"As far as my experience goes I treat clients for ME successfully. It is form of depression,"

You also mentioned this on a thread I had started on PVFS and while I was confused at first by what you said - I have had PVFS for 14 months, but am definitely not suffering from depression - I decided to investigate further.

You might like to check out this website:

It contains the latest research and includes a summary of CFS research findings provided by Anthony Komaroff, MD, a professor of medicine at Harvard Medical School, and the editor-in chief of Harvard Health Publications.

If you follow the link for Research Review Issues you will see his article entitled 'Top Ten Discoveries about the Biology of CFS'. Number 1 on this list states:

Chronic fatigue syndrome is not a form of depression, and many patients with CFS have no diagnosable psychiatric disorder. As with most chronic illnesses, some CFS patients become depressed because of the impact ofthe illness on their lives, but most studies find that the majority haven’t experienced depression before the onset of illness.

I do believe that in my own case, as I already stated elsewhere, there was a mind/body/spirit imbalance - some sufferers of PVFS might identify with this, others might not -but that should not be confused with depression!

Food for thought I hope.

P xx

I agree with Currentybun on this.

I have been recently diagnosed with PVFS (so am still getting my head around this condition!) but about 12 years ago suffered from stress related Depression.

Yes with PVFS I've been weepy and had recognisable (to me) manic-depression mood swings but knew instinctively that I wasn't Depressed!

I had enough self-awareness to know that I had some sort of imbalance in my "system". I am very happy in my work, under no abnormal pressure in my private life but I had been suffering from a nasty flu-like cold which knocked me for six and left me feeling tired and lethargic.

IMHO I believe it is that physical illness has made my mood low and not the other way around!!

Hi Everyone

Hi Everyone
I have been very busy lately renting a room and starting to treat clients as a holistic therapist. I am unable to give up my other part time job (2 days a week) until things pick up. I can only treat 3 clients a week at the moment but need to increase to 6 so I can give up the other job, thereby improving my life/work ratio. Why is this? because for the last 20 years I have had ME. It ruined my career as a fitness and swimming instructor and my childrens young years were marred by their mum always being ill. I have had to accept boring part time jobs and disbelief from both the medical profession, work colleagues and family. Of course I have been depressed and in the past put on antidepressents but they did not help the crippling ME symptoms! Every time I feel a little better I try to get on with my life and do something that really interests me and BANG, it bits me on the chin again. I only treated 2 clients on Tuesday and had to go to bed, my doctor has taken yet more blood tests but I know the answer already, nothing will be found. I have been offered cognitive behaviour therapy and spent 2 hours with a psychiatrist who told me I was most defienatly not depressed. I am so glad that there are some people who recognise that this is a disease and it annoys me so much that there are still some who maintain that it is a depressive illness. A big thank you for all your links and those of you who believe.