Wolf
I think I will put this on a new thread.
On the lost part of me thread you suggested trying a therapy before passing comment on its effectiveness or maybe reading a particular book. Sound advice to some I suppose and many will agree with your opinion.
But this all depends on what route you have taken to get to your current level of insight.
Personally I never followed the normal methods apart from learning and then teaching Reiki. Books were put down unread in nearly every case. The likes of meditation and sitting in circle were also instinctively rejected.
Simply put I used the energy in my hands to get myself to a point where the crap began to clear and clarity steadily developed. Reiki began the understanding of this process but I rejected the limitations contained in its approach. I made the choice to experience the difference glimpsed through constant interaction with Spirit. Reiki attempts to imitate the originality of Dr Usui and it no longer even begins to succeed. Some do not see it that way and thats ok they generally choose the ways to develop that I rejected.
Now everyone that is involved in almost any therapy talks about gut instinct and intuition and some actually use these traits even when it means going against accepted practices. To that I would add authenticate any therapy offered. But on further examination the individual is then equally encouraged to do the therapy and deny any instincts in the face of the supposed experienced teacher or therapist
Now I have looked at the likes of soul retrieval and shamanic healing etc. I have listened to my instincts, examined how I feel and asked if the therapy is authentic. The answer I have is no. So would reading a book or worse going against my instincts make any difference, no chance. The level of trust and harmony developed with Spirit and a number of years experience combine to keep me away from much of the newage industry.
All therapies are not authentic even if there are 50 books written about them. Equally some therapies began as an authentic avenue to the healing that Spirit provides. But on the death of the originator the authenticity was lost. Why? Simple really all that was left were those that simply copied the originator rather than attained the level of insight that would allow some continuation and genuine expression of an original and authentic therapy.
Sadly all therapies are not divinely created, if they were one therapy, system or potion would work in harmony with any other.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Now with respect, what does this post above have to do with spiritual healing?
But on the death of the originator the authenticity was lost. Why? Simple really all that was left were those that simply copied the originator rather than attained the level of insight that would allow some continuation and genuine expression of an original and authentic therapy.
Hmmm...40,000 years of shamans passing their skills onto others in the same way as every ancient spiritual tradition; it does beg the question who do you think the originator was of Shaman practices? There is no doubt in my mind, heart or soul that the indigenous have a powerful connection to what they call Great Spirit and who are you to judge whether something is authentic or not? It might not be so for you but exactly the same might be for others.
If you follow your own advice the only person who truly knows is the person themself and not you for others.
So if Wolfen or anyone feels they are working with a genuine, original and authentic therapy; then based upon some of your beliefs then they must be right because they are listening to their own intuition, soul and Great Spirit.
Your beliefs appear to contradict themselves and that can lead to a great deal of confusion, not only for yourself but also for others.
Now are we talking to Nancy or Steve?
Divine Love
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Now I have looked at the likes of soul retrieval and shamanic healing etc. I have listened to my instincts, examined how I feel and asked if the therapy is authentic. The answer I have is no. So would reading a book or worse going against my instincts make any difference, no chance. The level of trust and harmony developed with Spirit and a number of years experience combine to keep me away from much of the newage industry.
As Kim mentioned, 40,000 years of shamanic healing and you don't believe the therapy is authentic - this reminds me of born again christians who conveniently forget that before Jesus walked the Earth, the native americans/indigineous people had a very real relationship with Spirit. and are very knowledgeable on ways we can heal ourselves, and the importance of the soul. We have a lot to learn from the indigineous people.
newage industry
- there is nothing newage about shamanic healing and soul retrieval.
Love
Rosi x
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Actually its a very simple answer.
Anyone can claim to be a shaman, but again it comes down to authenticity. Shaman were born rather than taught--you either had it or you did not. If you did then one who was already a Shaman could support and advise Are their any authentic Shaman left alive? Or do we have an imitation of what was.
I do not belive what the way of the Shaman has become is authentic no. I agree it is not a new age therapy it never was actually a therapy, it was a way of being. But New age has encouraged all kinds of bull to be accepted.
There is no confusion in my mind at all I express my opinions based on my experience. I chose to point out that the way wolfen advised is not for all.
I do not seek agreement BUT i along with anybody else on HP have a right to express my opinions.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Actually its a very simple answer.
I will try again what does this thread have to do with spiritual healing?
Anyone can claim to be a shaman, but again it comes down to authenticity.
Well anyone can claim to be anything or anyone and I can understand your reservations from what I have been hearing lately about the US it seems you have a lot more charletans in the US than we appear to have here. Maybe you could clarify this ?
Shaman were born rather than taught--you either had it or you did not.
That is matter of personal belief unless of course you can provide some concrete evidence. That is like saying that healers are born to be healers when we all know that every soul has the ability to heal and be guided by Great Spirit. There really is no difference from my experience people are just given different methods to work with which is great because it would be very boring if Spirit led us all to the exactly the same way.......
If you did then one who was already a Shaman could support and advise Are their any authentic Shaman left alive? Or do we have an imitation of what was.
I do not belive what the way of the Shaman has become is authentic no. I agree it is not a new age therapy it never was actually a therapy, it was a way of being. But New age has encouraged all kinds of bull to be accepted.
Well I was led to Soul Retrieval by Spirit for important purpose. Do I call myself a Shaman ? No I do not. Why not? Because Soul Retrieval is a very small part what a Shaman did and does. It is also just one of my tools in my tool box. Have I met what you would consider a true Shaman yes I have and one of them is the foremost sound healer in Europe, he also runs a Mayan Mystery School he worked with the Mayan elders for over 20 years.
There is no confusion in my mind at all I express my opinions based on my experience. I chose to point out that the way wolfen advised is not for all.
Well with respect you do not have any experience of the therapy; as you have already shared that you rejected it in more ways than one, so what REAL knowledge/experience can you pffer when you have not trained in it or experienced the power of it?
I do not seek agreement BUT i along with anybody else on HP have a right to express my opinions.
Yes of course but it does help beginners on the path if you also make it clear you have never experienced the therapy in real terms so your opinion is purely subjective and based upon your own rejection of it.
Diivne Love
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Kim
it is not very often that i will say to you thank you so much, but on this occasion i will do just that,
WHY?
Because you have proved my point exactly!
You with your perceived greater experience in the area of aspects of Shamanic teachings are encouraging me to go against my instincts and gut feelings. Why? Again you think you know better.
My original post was not exactly pointed at soul retrival but at how i personally arrive at a decision to proceed on my pathway.
I used my way of asking and interpretation added to my experience to obtain an answer
For me personally it was the right way.
Wolf also found a way for him according to his understanding. i pointed out possible shortcomings. I cited my personal experience using soul retrival as just one example.
Again you share your perceived greater experience and understanding in order to decry my personal knowledge.
Now you may consider me a novice in terms of Shamanic healing, but i have had constant interaction with the realm of Spirit for far longer than i was ever aware of. Spirit knows all no matter what the label. Experience of the therapy in question is not always required.
For you to put down one opinion in preference to another simply because it agrees with your personal insight again confirms my reasoning behind the topic in question.
The topic of this thread is about how you arrive at a decision in regard to a therapy. Added to this is my experience of how some teachers react to your questions.
All therapies are based on interaction with Spirit. Spiritual healing would seem to be a reasonable location.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
When I first joined hp I had a bad neck.
I didnt join hp for help with the neck.
I didnt think that there was anything that could be done; just like the doctor had said.
My neck was very very painful.
It affected everything that I did; driving, house work, shopping and my most favourite hobby of all; fell walking. And I couldnt carry a rucksack. When I moved house I couldnt even lift my arms above my head to put up the curtains or fix a new light bulb.
You see, I know that I would never have chosen what helped me, cos if I had have known about it, I wouldnt have believed that it could help.
So, how could I choose it if
..
I either didnt know about it or
I didnt believe that it would help me?
And this is what I think that this post is all about;
Choices.
We all have the right to make our own choices.
Very often that choice is called an informed choice.
But isnt an informed choice going with the information that you have been given?
But I know that even if you had explained to me then, that healing from another person would have helped me, I would have run.
I would have legged it.
That is my intuition, my gut instinct.
I would not have allowed anyone to place hands on me then, to administer healing.
And yes that was my choice; but no amount of telling me would have persuaded me otherwise.
Stubborn I am at times; but thats me.
But when I read that there was a choice that I could place hands on myself and ask for healing, I was tempted. That again was my gut instinct.
And I wonder sometimes, and look back, and knowing how so very very stubborn I am; how was it that self healing was the one thing which I went with?
Knowing how I am, yet it was the one thing that I hesitated at, paused and thought; oh? Wot? My hands?
The pause time, the hesitation, the wondering.
I am amazed even now, that I did that pause.
And so so thankful that I did.
So; is this all about gut instinct or an informed choice?
My gut instinct is from within me; it is what I can trust.
Information from others is helpful; but what I still have to go with is how I feel when I read the words of others.
When I read the words of others; I do not need persuasion that what they are saying is right. Yes it is right for them and so may be for others too; otherwise why would someone be posting?
But; I see it like this; all I can do is go with how I feel when I read the words of others and go with my gut feeling.
And I wasnt thinking that this self healing would help me with my neck; I just thought that it would help me with a feeling of being so unhappy at times.
And, all this; really it is still is so so wow for me.
I never imagined that self healing could allow me the so much more.
Wow for that.
And that now, as a follow on, that healing can be allowed for others too. Wow again.
And yes, Im a newbie really to all this.
I only have my words to say it my way.
And I am trying to share my story, like so many do, here.
Am I something special? I dont think that I am. I am just one of those ordi
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Hi everyone,
This sounds like a thread that is going nowhere - again [sm=idea.gif].
By writing this - energy at work -are you actually proposing that people should follow your example, not read anything, not try anything, not understand anything? That sounds like an extremely sad way to lead your life.
There is so much out there to see, and so many wonderful people to talk to, so many countries and cultures to visit for you to share your joy and love of life and of the world around you. Your way sounds bereft of any sensory stimulation or wanting to share love with people. In none of your posts is there any sense of love for your fellow man. Have you ever been outside Kansas? if not, why not?
I'm not having a go at you, I simply don't understand your lack of spirituality when you want to talk on the spiritual pages.
Best wishes
Publisher
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Hi Pub
Am i saying that people should follow my way, absolutely not!
The idea is to find your own by following your instincts and level of experience.
Because i chose a differant route it does not mean i have not learnt. I choose not to read books on aspects of Spirituality. Why? because i have a far more insightful teachers that have been with me from birth. What i have learnt to do is listen and trust. I do however enjoy a good read on many other subjects.
Equally i am well aware of the big wide world and my life is in no way sad. I openly share all that i am as an individual.
Your comment that this thread is going nowhare means it does not fit with how you see things.
Am i wrong because i do not follow a path that fits with your understanding?
You seem very ready to condemm me personally. Have i ever been outside Kansas yes i am a Brit. Your snide comments would appear to show your love and compassion for your fellow man.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
These are the words of Spirit that we use as our guideline:
In each human is the seed of desire to make a difference in the worldto be able to impact a change upon society and upon other individuals. In some, this desire arises solely out of ego. I want to be in control. But in most, the desire is a pure and gently motivated wish to bring peace to other souls. It is frustrating, under these conditions, to be told that you must concentrate upon your own development. Society teaches that you must not think of yourself, rather you should do what you can for others and as a result, you will be rewarded.
However, in the same way that you cannot give a drink to another when your glass is empty, you cannot even begin to effect change if you are not willing to give the entirety of your existence toward your own development. The desire to hold onto what you have always known keeps you from being open to new truths. It may very well be that you may retain all of your former knowing, but you must be willing to give it up if it does not suit the you that can become.
Virtually all of the knowing that you require will come from within yourself. Occasionally you will hear from others words that resound for you. They will reinforce what you know in your heart. Sometimes, even, they will contradict what you think you know and will cause you to ponder their significance. With openness of thought you will receive the answer you need.
Respond to the questioning in your heart, for this is the source of your search for truth. Allow the questions to trickle through your thinking. Listen as they wear away the foundations of belief that no longer serves you. Heed the tugging at towers of self-created logic and allow the structure of ego to fall. Upon the remains will you build the abode of Love.
For you are Lovesimply and completely! Love does its work from one heart to another, one soul to another. Impact upon the world is accomplished in the same way.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Just a small point - if ' all therapies are not divinely created' ......... then what created them ?
My understanding and experience is that everything is Divine, without exclusion.
Both the shadow and the sunlight.
Without one there is no appreciation of the other.
So I feel that all therapies are in existence for a very good reason.
As is EVERYTHING !
With love , Ru xx
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Holos are you also a Brit or is that just Steve? Thank you for your clarification.
I want to be in control.
I also used to think like you and I had the same perception.
I used to think that the Solar Plexus was about ' I want to be in control'.
I think I was probably one of the first people to mention this on this forum five years ago. However, the divine corrected me and informed me that the Solar Plexus is actually the level of consciousness that is 'I AM POWER' and it is what we do with that power this is important. The divine gave further teaching that the Hara in which the Solar Plexus sits is in fact the Divine Shrine of the Divine and it is here that EGO the power and energy of God resides for the EGO is the omnipotence of God. I appreciate that this is not your truth so I am only sharing so that others gain a balance and a choice of what feels right to them. If and when we judge the EGO (which of course the divine do not judge anything) we are actually judging the self and God and that keeps us in the limitation of duality. However, each to their own.
Dear Ru
Totally agree
Dear Publisher
Totally agree and Nancy and Steve certainly do not have a monopoly on truth no more than anyone else does.
Divine Love
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
PS
Steve and Nancy
I feel exactly the same way about anyone who has formed an opinion based upon zero experience and judgement. For instance I do not talk about Tai Chi or Iridology because I have no experience to share and as such I do not even enter their forums.
The other aspect of this is that sometimes we reject something because our soul is not ready for it, but that doesn't mean we won't be ready for it in the future. So sometimes it is good to reserve judgement. A lot of people have come back years later saying at the time I could not accept what you shared and now I can, now I truly understand what you were trying to convey to me but my mind and heart was closed to the revelation. (That is a huge thing for people to do, to have the humility to apologise and say hey I was not in that space at that time but wow looking back it changed my life more than you will ever know.)
That often happens with Reiki and then after a few years some people have had so many messages pointing them in that direction that eventually they listen to what is being shown to them. The messages can become so powerful they are everywhere one looks; one can get to the point where one cannot ignore them anymore, so then people surrender to the divine and let go of human selves opinions, judgements and perceptions.
The same can be with Spirit, I remember one lady saying to me I kept viewing Quan Yin everywhere and then I came to HP and there you were talking about Quan Yin, she accepted this message from the universe.
I experienced the same in my early progression, I was surrounded by White Doves, they were on my working table, on my exhibition board, in my house, it was five years before I discovered that my higher self was White Dove and once I met my higher self, I was then led to be shown her life as a Native American. I am sure that you will agree sometimes the messages from Spirit can be very subtle.
Why is this?
Because in my experience they like us to take responsibility, to work it out for ourselves and sometimes that can be with the help of a human energy another soul that we have pre-ordained to meet on our journey. Spirit do not wish us to be dependent on them which is why they give us clues and symbology; otherwise we won't tune in for ourselves and that can interfere with the souls chosen journey. Plus once you become one with the source they have no need to guide us anymore, at first that can be a bit disconcerting, but it also signfys that it is time to increase the level of trust of the Godself - you are now the Buddha or Christ whichever one prefers.
Divine Love
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
Ru,
There have been Holy Wars, Crusades and any number of atrocities committed in the name of the Divine. I cannot believe, though, that the Divine actually had a part in either the inspiration of such a thing or the action.
The “therapies” enjoined upon the guests of Hitler during the Divine Holocaust do not seem to be authentic to me, although they were thoroughly justified by those who performed them.
Perhaps it depends upon which side of the “therapy” you are on.
Yes, there is good and there is evil, but there is also free will, which allows us to choose what we will express.
RE: Insight, intuition and Therapies
We are more than willing to discuss our thinking with anyone and everyone. We believe that true discussion leads to greater understanding.
We also have no difficulty in accepting that because we do not believe the majority of the mainline attitudes some will not see us as “spiritual.” That’s okay, because we know well who and what we are. We are real, with real joy and real pain and know where both originate. We also know how to deal with such things, and do so on a regular basis. It’s called healing.
Furthermore, we know that our stability—in the light of our refusal to go where we know we should not—is frightening to some, threatening to others, and downright stupidity to others. We are not here to post first or better or to claim superiority. We know what we know and are willing to share it. No one else has to accept it, but we all can grow if we can put aside childish concepts and converse as adults seeking for understanding.
Why is it that we, Steve and Nancy, do not and cannot embrace anything and everything that comes down the pike? Do you care, or is it enough to condemn us for our beliefs? We have both stated many times that the reason we post is so that those who need another point of view can find one. We continue with that in mind.