Yet again we have prostitutes being murdered by some nutter. Like it or not prostitutes will always exist and be very vunerable, no matter how much society looks down on them. Maybe its about time the Government accepted this and legalised properly licensed brothels and got these girls off the streets away from pimps and abusers andinto somewhere they are safe.
RE: Prostitute Murders
i agree with you woodcat and personally, i wish they would replace the word 'prostitute' with another one as it sounds so awful!
whilst some people may argue that there are better ways to make a living, for many who do it its not about choice, its about survival where they have been forced into it or is the only realistic way to bring in some money. the government should stop wasting money on white elephants and other pointless projects and bought in legalisation as well as help for those women who cannot help themselves.
warm wishes- calla lily x
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: calla lily
whilst some people may argue that there are better ways to make a living, for many who do it its not about choice, its about survival where they have been forced into it or is the only realistic way to bring in some money.
calla lily x
The `survival` you speak of is not food or shelter but their drug habit.
Without exception each one of these girls is a drug addict.
I haven't got the answers unfortunately, but while people protrayed in the media like Pete Doherty and Kate Moss as `cool` despite of, or because of, their drug taking it is giving out the message that to take drugs is OK.
I watched part (I couldn't bear to watch all) of the programme with Monty Don who is trying to get drug users away from heroin and working on the land. One girl on there looks awful and is constantly vomiting because of drug damage to her oseophogus and readily agrees she is not long for this world.
These murdered girls and others have said they have to get their fix and prostitution is a quick way of getting money.
RE: Prostitute Murders
Your right orangeblossom, there is no answer to this really. I prefer the idea of prostitutes havingclean, safe environments, but I think we are on the road to nowhere trying to find a solution to this problem.
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom
The `survival` you speak of is not food or shelter but their drug habit.These murdered girls and others have said they have to get their fix and prostitution is a quick way of getting money.
Wow! Thats quite an amazing sweeping judgement to make of all sex-workers!!
Some do walk the streets to get the next drug fix, some are forced into it by pimps, but you know what some actually really enjoy it! I read several blogs of sex workers and they do it because its a job they enjoy. I also know several male sex workers and have discussed it with them, again they love their jobs.
So lets keep the Daily Hate-Mail style judgements and headlines out of it please.
RE: Prostitute Murders
Quite right, fozzyo... this argument is never going to go anywhere as long as everyone assumes that all people in the sex business are pathetic specimens in cheap trainers and Asda jeans on street corners trying to scrape together enough to buy their next bag of heroin. Of course, some of them are - and that has been highlighted by the sad Ipswich cases - but there are doctors and bankers who are drug addicts, and nobody assumes assumes that ALL doctors and bankers have a drug habit.
Of course, most women will find the idea of female prostitution distasteful and it's clearly an option most would never consider. Then again, I wouldn't want to be a vicar and would find that distasteful - but it doesn't mean vicars should be castigated or banned!
And as for Harriet Harman's suggestion that it should be made illegal to pay for sex... well, the woman's naivety staggers me! Though, having said that, it is a typical New Labour suggestion: make it illegal and it will all go away (rather like: remove Saddam, and everybody will be happy, but that's another argument).
I don't buy thetheory that it's impossible to legislate against something just because it has always gone on, but... surely the only things that legislation should be concerned withare: 1. no nuisance is caused to other people, not involved in the business; 2. nobody under-age should be involved; and 3. nobody should be forced into the business against their will. Other than that, surely we are talking consenting adults here, aren't we?
RE: Prostitute Murders
Prostitution isn't going to go away so ignoring it wont fix anything.
I agree that making sweeping statements about most prostitutes only doing it to fuel their drug habit is not a fair one. I actualy know a couple of "working girls" & they are as drug free & as mentaly stable as you & me. They generally don't tell people what it is that they do because of the reactions they will get, but to them it is just a job.
If prostitution was legallised,moderated & taxed, the main problems with prostitution woud be minimised & the girls would be safer. I don't believe that legalising it would encourage women to do it at all & these murders would be a lot more difficult to commit.
SS
x
p.s. Supersub, what's wrong with Asda's jeans?! :Dlol
RE: Prostitute Murders
That wasn't meant to be a slur on Asda! I might as well have said Primark, which is where mine come from...
Couldn't help wondering though, seeing recent footage of "street girls" in Ipswich, how appealing those women look (not very to me!) and how much of a stretch of the imagination it would take to find them attractive, and how practical it is to get tight jeans off in the back of a car. Might just be my dirty mind!
It reminded me of an encounter I once had in a city where I used to work late and where I had to walk home at night past several prostitutes. I'd always give them a cheery hello (one late workerto another...) but one chillingly cold night, one of them touched my cheek and said something along the lines of "Come on, darling, give yourself a treat!" Frankly, I couldn't at that moment imagine anything that would be less of a treat than going up some stinking alley in the dark, exposing any part of my body to the freezing cold and doing anything with the sad, chilled, underfed, druggy-looking woman standing in front of me! But maybe that was just me being picky...
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: calla lily
i agree with you woodcat and personally, i wish they would replace the word 'prostitute' with another one as it sounds so awful!
How about "Lovely Ladies of the Evening"?
RE: Prostitute Murders
Both asda and primark are selling cheap clothes by oppressing third world workers.
I would rather admit to procuring prostitutes than buying asda jeans. These having been made by workers who are paid as little as 3p an hour.
[link= http://www.ethicalconsumer.org/magazine/news/newspages.htm ]http://www.ethicalconsumer.org/magazine/news/newspages.htm[/link]
If it is really cheap it is because someone got really screwed making it.
As for the Evil peace of s**t that murdered these lasses I'm just glad Trudi spotted him a bubbled him before he could go any further.
With regard to the legalisation I find it hard to understand how selling something you own to someone it isn't necessarily going to harm is wrong/illegal apart from our allowing ourselves to begoverned bylaws based on ancient superstition.
Govern the supply of Heroin and you get rid of the Dealers.
A daily fixthen costs 7p the girls won't need to lie down to get enough to pay for it and the pimps grip over them is loosened.
You can now control qualityincreasing the health of a massive group in society at a stroke.
Surely it's a win win win situation.
People will always want to take drugswhy not keep them out of crime.
jono
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: fozzyo
Wow! Thats quite an amazing sweeping judgement to make of all sex-workers!!
Sorry but where did I make sweeping judgements about `all sex workers`?
I made a reference to 5 murdered women who were all drug adicts.
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: jonnyhotpants
With regard to the legalisation I find it hard to understand how selling something you own to someone it isn't necessarily going to harm is wrong/illegal apart from our allowing ourselves to begoverned bylaws based on ancient superstition.Govern the supply of Heroin and you get rid of the Dealers.
A daily fixthen costs 7p the girls won't need to lie down to get enough to pay for it and the pimps grip over them is loosened.
You can now control qualityincreasing the health of a massive group in society at a stroke.Surely it's a win win win situation.
People will always want to take drugswhy not keep them out of crime.
Yet again I find myself on the same page as you Jono, agree with the whole post mate.
ORIGINAL: jeannie
Your right orangeblossom, there is no answer to this really. I prefer the idea of prostitutes havingclean, safe environments, but I think we are on the road to nowhere trying to find a solution to this problem.
Why (or how) do you think trying to find a solution to this problem would put us on a road to nowhere? Wouldnt you agree that Jonnyhotpants reply later, very quickly outlines a very good framework of how to answer this problem Jeannie
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom
I haven't got the answers unfortunately, but while people protrayed in the media like Pete Doherty and Kate Moss as `cool` despite of, or because of, their drug taking it is giving out the message that to take drugs is OK.
Hi Orangeblossom, Im not nit-picking, I just want to say that I happen to think Pete Doherty is highly talented, very engaging, (I find him) bright and a superb songwriter of our time
Personally I dont think the media have portrayed him s cool if anything I find they constantly try and portray him as a waster & a total loser.
As for his drug taking he has some illustrious company in his particular field from Miles Davis, Ray Charles & Billie Holliday to John Lennon, Bowie, Kurt Cobain, Hendrix, Syd Barrett & Bob Marley, etc
(the list goes on)
The taking of Opium and opium derivatives like LSD is not a new phenomenon nor is it the sole preserve of the lowlifes and underachievers of society From historical military icons like Alexander the Great & Marcus Aurelius to literary giants like Baudelaire, Byron, Shelley, Coleridge, Keats, Elizabeth Barrett Browning, Dickens, Oscar Wilde, Edgar Allen Poe, Arthur Conan Doyle, Aldus Huxley & filmmaker & author Jean Cocteau.
And Pablo Picasso wasnt the only great painter to do so either, rather he heads up an extensive list of distinguished people with a flair for artistic representation with a taste for it
In the more serious and practical world - from statesmen like Benjamin Franklin & George Washington, to inventors like Douglas Englebart (he invented the mouse) & Steve Jobs of Apple computers all users of Opium or LSD derivatives.
Moreover, it is not confined to only creative circles but happens to pepper the medical & scientific community too - Sigmund Freud, Carl Sagan & (not that I like her much but) Dr. Susan Blackmore
it also includes Nobel
RE: Prostitute Murders
Hi Conspiritualist
So are you suggesting all the good and the great (as you see them) got where they are, or where they were because of taking drugs?
I would suggest the talent was there in the first place and the need for narcotics didn't exist.
Perhaps you haven't read the background to these murdered girls. Their slide on the slippery slope started when they were hooked on drugs. I am afraid you will not convince me otherwise that it is an acceptable way to live.
RE: Prostitute Murders
Supersub your a hoot!
[sm=rollaugh.gif][sm=rollaugh.gif][sm=rollaugh.gif]
Sorry others don't mean to be flippent but he just made me laugh, I know this was started (and is) a serious issue!
RE: Prostitute Murders
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom I would suggest the talent was there in the first place and the need for narcotics didn't exist.
Sure, you can suggest all you want about the talent already being there, as I dont disagree with it I belong to the line of thinking that all humans possess great potential.
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom
I am afraid you will not convince me otherwise that it is an acceptable way to live.
Dont be afraid Orangeblossom, 😉
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom
Perhaps you haven't read the background to these murdered girls. Their slide on the slippery slope started when they were hooked on drugs,
It seems you misunderstood my post (its quite understandable, as I know I can go on a bit)
but anyway, without the drugs being illegal, without prostitution being illegal
there would not be a dark, dangerous and criminally infested slippery slope
there would just be a slidey slope
see?
ORIGINAL: orangeblossom So are you suggesting all the good and the great (as you see them) got where they are, or where they were because of taking drugs?
Your sentence assumes that a) I see them as great and b) assumes that they did not get where they are or where they were because of taking drugs
I suggest you research some of them and youll find that some of indeed did achieve because of drugs
🙂
Moreover, some of them have even publically stated that their greatest triumphs or breakthroughs have been because of their trip (even Nobel Prize winning scientists)...:)Whoops!
Anyway, it wasnt the point I was making
I was just trying to demonstrate that Opium and its derivatives have been being regularly used in British and US public society at all levels from prostitutes to Nobel Prize Winners, and from fictional crime writers to even aQueen of England.
Basically, that itspart of the British Empire legacy and that it aint gonna go away![:-]