In my view everything happens perfectly, even the bad stuff. But that can be very hard to get your head around.
It extremely hard to get your head around. It is something that has come up for me many times in meditation and I have moments of suddenly just "getting it" before it slips away again and it's "nope - don't understand" again.
Another thing (which I don't think is going too off topic, because this thread has become little to do with attonement, forgiveness etc) - I was recently part of a jury which tried a defendant for quite a serious crime, for which we found them guilty. They were not sentenced on the day of our verdict but I heard some weeks afterwards that a substantial sentence had been given. Whilst I had taken my duty as a juror very seriously and I am sure our verdict was correct, I was not prepared for how I felt on learning of the sentence that was given. I can't describe it. It was almost an "oh my goodness, what have we done?" kind of feeling. I felt quite desolate knowing that this person was going to lose their freedom for so long. I know they are responsible for their crime and the decision about their sentence was not mine either, but I did play a part in taking away someone's freedom and I felt quite humbled. We are all just one mistake away from losing our freedom in this way. I know this would need to be quite a substantial "mistake" but.... I don't know what I am trying to say really, other than that I have reassessed my feelings about being judgemental to others as a result of this experience. I think I realise how dangerous this could be now and maybe it is right that we don't know.....?
Sorry if this has gone a bit :offtopic:
Thank you for correcting my error - never multitask! I do mean prison does NOT rehabilitate. You're more likely to come out more damaged that when you went in.
Christina
About Prisons
I tend to agree with a comment made by a priest on that awful Nicky Campbell program that was on the telly yesterday. His view was that people end up in prison because they are 'broken' and that we should forget the notion of prison as a punishment and start to look at it as a place of healing. I would add to that that the purpose of prison should also be to keep dangerous people away from the public.
Our whole justice system doesn't work at the moment, we (influenced by the media / politicians) tend to take a much too simplistic view of the causes of and solutions to 'crime' and anti-social behaviour. We need to look much more at the bigger societal influences and adopt a more nuanced approach to dealing with people who are a danger to others.
I was about 18 when the little boy was murdered. All I remember thinking at the time was how awful it was, how do you judge two 10 year-old boys for something like this and that I was glad I never had to make a decision on how to deal with them... I still don't know whether they were in prison for long enough or released at the right time... It's so alien to my experience of life...
I can barely remember what I was like at ten...
I can't help but think that society as a whole failed both Jamie Bulger and those two boys. And yes, it's fair to say that not everyone who comes from a disturbed background goes on to commit crimes, but surely most crimes are committed by emotionally damaged people? I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing that most people with a happy and secure childhood don't go on to commit horrendous murders.
I was listening to a talk radio station the other night and there were an appalling number of people who'd thought those boys should've been hung.
I can't help but note than whenever you get a Facebook group set up for things like this - there were a few about Baby P as well - there are often calls for violent retribution with swearing, poor spelling, poor grammar and little or no punctuation or capital letters... What does this suggest? I'm not sure, but I never fail to notice it.
I can't help but note than whenever you get a Facebook group set up for things like this - there were a few about Baby P as well - there are often calls for violent retribution with swearing, poor spelling, poor grammar and little or no punctuation or capital letters... What does this suggest? I'm not sure, but I never fail to notice it.
A propos the above, I will always remember something I read in an article not long after Thompson and Venables were sentenced. Basically the article, if I remember correctly, was about the writer Gitta Sereny who had written a book about Mary Bell, another infamous child killer. She had written an appendix to the book about the Bulger killing and the journalist who wrote the article was following up on this. He was interviewing a mother of several small children who was telling him how the boys should either be locked away forever or indeed hanged when she was interrupted by one of her toddlers. Without missing a beat she turned round and said 'If you don't *ing shut yer gob, I'll put yer in a binbag and throw you out the *ing window'.
So I understand where you're coming from, Tigerlily. And I do agree with John D's post above. In another article I read one of the former Directors of Feltham Young Offenders Institute (whom I subsequently met in person) said that in his opinion the only people who should be locked up were those whose personality disorders were so serious that there could be no hope whatsoever in salvaging them. He claimed that prison does no good whatsoever with the usual range of offenders. Whether the Bulger boys fall within that scope is not for me to say...
Very interesting, Sunanda. Often, poeple's reaction to these sort of crimes frighten me more than the crimes themselves. Wasn't there an incident of graffitti or vandalism at the house of a paediactrician a few years ago? Whereby the perpetrator had confused the words 'paediatrian' and 'paedophile'? This is another very good reason why the papers shouldn't reveal exact details of Jon Venables' latest incarceration. Because 'the mob' takes over, jumps to conclusions and acts without rational thought... I find that a very frightening prospect.
I remember the paedophile hysteria. And hysteria is what it becomes. Anyone would think that Jon Venables is some kind of monstrous blood sucking vampire, intent on murdering every child in the land. And of course the mob hysteria is whipped up by tabloids like the Sun which appeal to the lowest common denominator in the country. If Venables new identity is revealed - and it probably will be at some point - then I would not be at all surprised to learn that he has been lynched, either in jail or out.
Just received text message with his new identity, where he lives and what he has done! and for me to pass it on! Am not going to in case is it a scam and if it is genuine wouldn't want to prejudice jury.
Amethystfairy:confused:
Oh my goodness!!
It's worrying.
Just received text message with his new identity, where he lives and what he has done! and for me to pass it on! Am not going to in case is it a scam and if it is genuine wouldn't want to prejudice jury.
Me too, I always take these things with a pinch of salt!
Vigilante attitudes are not the answer.
Just had a thought regarding that text and how dangerous 'the mob' is. What's to stop a not-very-bright individual from starting a rumour about someone they knew either out of malice or ignorance?
Not only that, but I wonder how many people are going to get beaten up by thugs who mistakenly think they are Venables? I wonder if there's prisoners up and down the country closely watching out for a nervous-looking twenty-something year old just arrived in their prison?
The name doing the rounds is the same name as the guy accused of being John Venables 5 years ago. At the time his life was made a misery and apparently it was proved that he is not Venables. The text means that he has to go through the whole thing again.
People really should be more responsible and check things like this before forwarding them. Imagine if it was your name that someone sent round.
The name doing the rounds is the same name as the guy accused of being John Venables 5 years ago. At the time his life was made a misery and apparently it was proved that he is not Venables. The text means that he has to go through the whole thing again.
People really should be more responsible and check things like this before forwarding them. Imagine if it was your name that someone sent round.
Thats just it though Bannick....there are some major twats in this world who are thick enough not to care.
Patchouli
Just received text message with his new identity, where he lives and what he has done! and for me to pass it on! Am not going to in case is it a scam and if it is genuine wouldn't want to prejudice jury.
Amethystfairy:confused:
People really should be more responsible and check things like this before forwarding them. Imagine if it was your name that someone sent round.
Oh for the love of God, what kind of people feel the need to send texts to their friends naming names in cases like this. Never mind checking before sending, people simply shouldn't send them in the first place. My blood runs cold to think of it. I hope I don't receive any such texts as I would have something to say to the sender if I did. 😡
I have seen this on face book saying the name where he lives and what he has done, for this person who has been cleared to be name as venables is a disgrace. that man has to go on again to clear his name in public. to be accused for some thing so terrible must be awful for him.