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 keke
(@keke)
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The news of the terror attacks in France these past few days has been harrowing and my heart goes out to all those who have been effected.

But it warms my heart to say the people of France come out of their houses in their thousands to show their unity and support of democracy at this time. In the past we have seen presidents and prime ministers make their speeches on behalf of a nation - but to see real people let their feelings be known in such a peaceful way is really beautiful.

Well done to the people of France, and I would like to speak up here to show my unity too.


 
Posted : 10/01/2015 6:57 pm
Crowan
(@crowan)
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I am in no way taking sides here, nor am I pretending that this is anything other than terrible, but to say this is about "democracy" - or that other over worked word of the past few days, "freedom" - is to make rather large assumptions. Is this not wishful thinking on our part?


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 9:02 am
 keke
(@keke)
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No it's not Crowan.


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 11:56 am
Crowan
(@crowan)
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Wow! That's a really good way to eliminate discussion! There's democracy for you.


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 1:12 pm
Crowan
(@crowan)
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Try this for discussion opening: here


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 2:45 pm
(@mountaineer)
Posts: 861
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I don't know about you, but if those attacks really were 'inspired' by offence at those cartoons they seriously miscalculated. Out of curiosity I've viewed the whole lot on Google Images. No doubt tens if not hundreds of millions of others have too. So they've really just created publicity for the very thing they were so opposed to.
There was one which, yes, was over the top, the rest were just silly nonsense. Certainly no cause for any sort of violence.

I remember Christians got worked up over 'The Life of Brian' when it came out all those years ago. They didn't go around killing people over it though.

No religion is served by violence.


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 3:44 pm
(@mountaineer)
Posts: 861
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The rights and wrongs of immigration, I haven't got the time or energy, but whatever your view it's the reality and the only answer is social integration. Cuts both ways of course. But, yes, there you have it.

Faith schools and the lack of social integration (wanting to integrate on the one hand & being accepted on the other) are leading us down a dangerous path.
Have we learnt nothing from Northern Ireland?


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 3:51 pm
 keke
(@keke)
Posts: 70
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Crowan, you asked " Is this not wishful thinking on our part?" and my reply was, no it's not.

What has made an impression on me in the way the people of France have shown unity, is that it is not one person speaking on behalf of the many - this is what you have tried to do with the use of the pronoun 'our' - instead it is individuals choosing for themselves to leave their homes and to show their own faces or add their own words to this.

Democracy is allowing people to speak for themselves. So my reply was entirely in the recognition of democratic decision making in the face of being asked about wishful thinking being on 'our' part.

However, it seems you have chosen to give the thread a discussion point of your own choosing. So I shall leave you to that one.


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 5:58 pm
Reiki Pixie
(@reiki-pixie)
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Nice to see the solidarity amongst the peoples of France after the recent shootings. 3 million marched in Paris according to one news report today. Shame that many of the top politicians that attended are warmongers, state-terrorists, and dictators!!


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 8:20 pm
Crowan
(@crowan)
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"Support of democracy" suggests that this was an attack on democracy. I am not questioning anything other than the idea that the shootings were about attacking democracy. There is no evidence for this.


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 8:42 pm
amy green
(@amy-green)
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What a truly massive and strong message today's marches give - 40 world leaders uniting in Paris to support freedom of speech. One and a half million people turned out to be there. Also this event was hugely supported here in London.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-30765824


 
Posted : 11/01/2015 9:59 pm
Principled
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I agree Amy, hugely moving. Seeing so many millions of people of different backgrounds and beliefs standing together. Hearing Muslims condemn the atrocities in no uncertain terms and reaching out to Jews. Hearing about the bravery and unselfishness during the attacks. I hope this will be a turning point which will wake people up and make us all realise that we have to stand together to face down radicalism and control by fear.

Above all, I hope people will learn that hatred can never overcome love. Darkness can never overcome light.

Love and peace,

Judy


 
Posted : 12/01/2015 12:07 am
Principled
(@principled_1611052765)
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I popped back into here, as I had a look to see what the Christian Science Monitor's angle would be - interesting - not democracy, but dignity:

It starts off with these words:
[url]Best defense of free speech: individual dignity[/url]

Nearly three million rallied in France on Sunday, standing up for freedom of expression and against last week’s attacks on the cartoonists at the Charlie Hebdo newspaper. Dozens of world leaders joined them. The event marked a global assertion not only for free speech but the deeper value that lies behind it – the intrinsic worth of each individual, no matter their views.
The crowds in France were nearly as large as those after the Allied liberation of Paris in 1945. This shows just how many people today seek to preserve the idea that dignity is inherent in everyone – simply as created beings. Their dignity transcends their social or material circumstances, even their intelligence and morality. It is, in fact, so fundamental that after World War II, all countries joined in signing the Universal Declaration of Human Rights of the United Nations that states: “All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.”


 
Posted : 12/01/2015 12:21 am
Crowan
(@crowan)
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"freedom of speech" - that's another one.


 
Posted : 12/01/2015 12:31 am
jeannie
(@jeannie)
Posts: 1848
Noble Member
 

Religion, there are more wars, worries, terror and all the rest of it down to religion.

I don't want to be black even yellow or white
I don't want to be on the left or on the right
I don't want to be Catholic, Christian or Jew
I only want JUSTICE for me and for YOU
You see I think this world would be a far better place if
we were all just members of the HUMAN RACE!


 
Posted : 12/01/2015 12:09 pm
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