Being Authentic

Hi Amy

It is precisely this inner divisional conflict that the video addresses, i.e. to walk the talk
- not to just say one thing and act another. This is what being authentic is.

Unfortunately to have a talk that revolves around a judgement of rightness and wrongness that requires us to walk that judgemental tight walk between the judgements of what we perceive to be right or wrong within the fullness of self, it sets one aspect of self up to be right, in opposition to another aspect of self, which is judged to be wrong, it is the judgement itself that sets up the inner conflict within self.

Do you not think it would be a lot better not to have a judgemental talk in the first place and just allow ourselves to be?

Of course all words may be valid. The choice of words here relate to the subject!!!!

That is my point, the subject is supposed to be about authenticity within self, that requires us to include all aspects of self, not just the bits that we judge to be good and reject or repress the bits that we judge to be bad, we are all complete within the fullness of self, we need to embrace every aspect of self if we wish to be authentic, otherwise we are creating divisional conflicts within self. 🙂

Again you miss the point. That's the issue, i.e. so many people don't behave
according to their beliefs. For instance there's a difference between someone
who purports to be a Christian but their actions/behaviour betray them and one
who is a Christian and whose beliefs shine through the way they conduct themselves.

That is because people are choosing to employ judgements in place of authenticity, if we have no judgements to live up to or put ourselves down with, then we are what we are which is being authentic. 😉

There is such a thing as discernment, without which you would make no sense of the world.

Yes we all have inner discernment and guidance, but that is not the same as a judgement, though if we choose to discern something through a judgement, then the discernment will only reflect what the judgement creates for us.

OK now it talks about what we need to achieve this, it says that we need commitment and we should fight the temptation to compromise our values and beliefs, so we are encouraged to intensify the inner divisional conflicts that we have chosen to create through our judgements and declare war on aspects of our consciousness that do not agree with our divisional judgements!

Again with the conflicts - no!!! Conflicts only exist when we are not integrated - you
appear to have missed the essential message of this video. :rolleyes:

The essential message surrounds a judgement of right over wrong which is the theme of most spiritual development practices, it says that if we embrace the aspects of self that we judge to be right and reject the aspect of self that we judge to be wrong then we will gain stature and pride, personal development does not work on right or wrong it works on embracing the fullness of self non-judgmentally.

Please explain to me how accepting one aspect of self whilst rejecting and repressing another aspect of self can create wholeness and authenticity?

This video addresses those inner conflicts in order that we may achieve integration.e

Again, please explain to me how we can integrate the fullness of self by rejecting self through self judgement?

Sure you can let go of all standards - you can be immoral. That would be a different video don't you think?

To perceive self as moral or immoral requires us to place a divisional judgement within the fullness of self, this will only create inner division between the aspects of self that we judge to be moral or immoral, please explain how this would make us authentic or whole?

The next part says to build a reputation as someone who tells the truth, I think this is what Giles refers to as ego, for we do not need to create an ego to project to the world around us, we just need to be.

Wow - how did you arrive at that from addressing the truth? :confused:

To set about creating an outward image of truthfulness requires us to build a persona or ego based upon that perceived judgement of truth, this unfortunately is not being authentic because it is not portraying the full picture of everything that is within the fullness of self, outside of the judgement of truth which varies from person to person, we have what is.

There's a difference between those who already are authentic and those striving/interested in this issue (who this video is really for).

But that is my point, how will anyone who chooses to embrace this divisional judgemental approach and apply it within the fullness of self, become authentic?

Peace and pride can go hand in hand - I have experienced this combination
when I did voluntary work.

But non the less they are not the same thing, we achieve inner peace and harmony when we are happy with the fullness of self, we achieve pride when we judge that we have done something in an acceptable manner.

No - it's when we get rid of the conflict between what we think/believe and how our actions don't match this that there is no division. I think you are fond of using the
words division and judgement. This video addresses confict (i.e. division) because
it lacks integrity. Judgement is your word to criticise what needs to be focused on to
discern what is the case.

That is because a judgement will alway create a division between one thing and anther thing and division leads to conflict, this video addresses the judgement of rightness and being true to that judgement in opposition to what someone Judges to be a falseness and so rejects.

This is not being authentic towards self, it is being judgemental towards self, we deal with people's self imposed judgemental divisional conflicts all of the time, not by judging them to be right or wrong, but by replacing them with self acceptance in an open and non-judgemental way, we heal people by replacing their divisional judgemental conflicts with wholeness, so that they can be authentic.

Sadly you end with your basic misunderstanding, i.e. the inner conflicts. It is this that the video addresses - to look at this, see what needs addressing in order to become more authentic.

Hopefully when you answer my questions, then you will have a better understanding of the word authentic in relation to self. 🙂

Yes we all have inner discernment and guidance, but that is not the same as a judgement, though if we choose to discern something through a judgement, then the discernment will only reflect what the judgement creates for us.

“discernment”
Noun - the ability to judge well.
Synonyms – discrimination – perspicacity – acumen – judgement

Could you help solve my confusion by giving your definitions of “discernment” and “judgement” please, Paul?

Hi Crowan

“discernment”
Noun - the ability to judge well.
Synonyms – discrimination – perspicacity – acumen – judgement

Could you help solve my confusion by giving your definitions of “discernment” and “judgement” please, Paul?

Yes, we have the ability to discern things as they are outside of judgement or we have the ability to judge something and then apply that judgement to the perception that the discernment is creating within us.

So we look at an object and discern it to be a car (which is what it is), but we can also choose to place a judgement upon the car and classify it as a good or a bad car. 🙂

We do have a choice in the way we chose to think about things and that directly influences the way that we perceive them, if we have a judgemental way of being, then the perception of something is often clouded by the underlying judgements that are automatically placed upon it. 😉

Asking questions is rude? How did I belittle you? I am sorry if you felt that - it was my intention only to point out what you missed; perhaps you do not take well to being shown this? Yes I read your post carefully (twice actually) and no, I saw no ego being depicted in the clip I posted....just spirit. Please share where you think it indicated ego. Integrity is a noble trait and encompasses our whole being.

Paul correctly (and more clearly) highlights the points I was talking about.

When I talk of the ego in the video it's the points where it tells you that by doing such and such we will become more "heroic" or a "person of quality".

The truth is that a person does not need to be heroic or a person of quality to be living
truthfully or with integrity or to be authentic. If one takes the messages as they are presented, then they are going to seek to do those things because it is telling them that they will become a better person (in whatever respect)... but better than what? As Paul correctly points out, such a "better" judgement creates division, and hence duality, and when duality exists, so does conflict. The same video could have been produced without the need to tell people that by doing X, Y and Z they will become heroic, or a person of quality (and whatever else it said - I can't access the video at the minute)). Why didn't it say to do those things, because it's the truthful and honest thing to do and is for the benefit of everyone and everything? Why limit it to just putting the focus on the individual and the benefit's they would perceive?

So, as I was saying in my response, it's all fine and good giving a message to tell people they should act with integrity, or to be truthful, or to be kind to all others etc., but when that gets tied in with the message of "do this because you will better yourself" then this is tapping into the ego of the person, and the ego stems from the mind, which is not the true non-judgemental self.

The messages in the video were not missed on me. I can understand the 'nice' message it's trying to put across, but reading between the lines (and also literally the words used), it is not just about being authentic, it's about marketing into a persons desire to want to be better (tap into their ego) to get them to believe that they need to do these things and they'll somehow become heroic etc. whilst at the same time missing the point completely about just Being, truthfully without judgement.

It is in the nature of a forum that people constantly make judgemental responses to posts - I see nothing out of line here. I don't expect you to agree with me but I was
(quite frankly) stunned by how out of synch what your post said as to what was
actually in the clip. The correlation was very weak if not puzzling.

A matter of one's own perception filters perhaps?

I don't wish to be rude, Giles. I wish to be honest (honestly). My perception is that you are the one who gets offended - perceives rudeness - when you can't ram your understanding down someone else's throat. In effect preaching to them, in the manner that you usually accuse them of doing.

If this is coming across to you as me being rude, that's because I'm expecting you to go on the defensive about it, because you're attached to your current level of understanding, which in turn is putting me on the defensive in preparation. Like you, I don't appreciate being preached to either.

Not at all WS, not rude at all, though I'm not sure why you perceive me as ramming my understanding down people's throats, when all I do is post honestly and truthfully to (try and) clarify where someone may have misunderstood what I am saying. In the case of this thread, I took the time to watch the video (you didn't though eh. 😉 :D) and posted an honest critque of the message and how it was presented, not saying it was a pointless video, but highlighting where it was clearly using techniques to tap into people's ego to get it's message across (something which a lot of people miss - but that's marketing for you!) which isn't about being authentic and true (not that there aren't truthful messages in the video, there certainly are i.e. we should live with integrity, honesty etc. and aim to live what we teach others).

As for your expectation of me getting defensive and you getting defensive in preparation... let go of your future 'fear' 🙂 there's no need for it... certainly not in this present moment. :hug:

All Love and Reiki Hugs

Yes, we have the ability to discern things as they are outside of judgement or we have the ability to judge something and then apply that judgement to the perception that the discernment is creating within us.

So we look at an object and discern it to be a car (which is what it is), but we can also choose to place a judgement upon the car and classify it as a good or a bad car. 🙂

We do have a choice in the way we chose to think about things and that directly influences the way that we perceive them, if we have a judgemental way of being, then the perception of something is often clouded by the underlying judgements that are automatically placed upon it. 😉

You are aware, aren't you, that this is your definition? General usage of "judgement" can be, "Yes, I judge that to be a car."
So, if you are using your own definitions, how can you know (and in place of "know", most people would accept "judge", or even "guess") how someone else is using the word?