Hey Dogwoman
Thanks for answering - I consult both ascendant and sun sign too!
Appollo - thanks for your detailed answer. I've also studied astrology for about 25 years! and absolutely agree with you re the importance of the rest of the chart. But the sun sign IS very, very important - after all, it's the sun that keeps the Earth going; it's always THERE as a presence, whether we feel its power or not. Without the sun, there would be no life here. And in astrology, as I understand it, it's the ascendant which shows what we project now, in a way, while it's the sun sign which determines what we are working towards - the self-actualisation of us: the core of us.
So it's little wonder, really, that the sun sign is seen as being THE sign, and that was changed from the ascendant. Of course the rest of the chart is important when it comes to character, and forecasts, and it goes without saying that nobody with any knowledge of astrology would go by the sun sign alone when drawing up a chart - but the sun sign is hardly a negligable part of the horoscope in any sense!!!
As for the horoscopes in mags and newspapers - I doubt anyone really takes them seriously - they're a bit of fun. They may point to some general trends; they may buck you up a bit if you're feeling down, but they're not serious astrology. They can be a very good starting point, though, to promote interest, and keep astrology in the mainstream.
All the best,
Cinammon
Hey Dogwoman
Thanks for answering - I consult both ascendant and sun sign too!
Appollo - thanks for your detailed answer. I've also studied astrology for about 25 years! and absolutely agree with you re the importance of the rest of the chart. But the sun sign IS very, very important - after all, it's the sun that keeps the Earth going; it's always THERE as a presence, whether we feel its power or not. Without the sun, there would be no life here. And in astrology, as I understand it, it's the ascendant which shows what we project now, in a way, while it's the sun sign which determines what we are working towards - the self-actualisation of us: the core of us.
So it's little wonder, really, that the sun sign is seen as being THE sign, and that was changed from the ascendant. Of course the rest of the chart is important when it comes to character, and forecasts, and it goes without saying that nobody with any knowledge of astrology would go by the sun sign alone when drawing up a chart - but the sun sign is hardly a negligable part of the horoscope in any sense!!!
As for the horoscopes in mags and newspapers - I doubt anyone really takes them seriously - they're a bit of fun. They may point to some general trends; they may buck you up a bit if you're feeling down, but they're not serious astrology. They can be a very good starting point, though, to promote interest, and keep astrology in the mainstream.
All the best,
Cinammon
Cinammon,
Kind regards...
I think my main ethos in this subject is derived from a deep rooted issue with the way society as a whole is kept in perpetual ignorance by media moguls in regard to astrology - by the drip drip feeding of 'garbage astrology'... I don't like the way it paints the picture - and no doubt as you and I both know by now, real astrology has infinite possibilities to offer Humanity - yet it is seemingly forever kept as a 'hidden science'. IMHO the 'garbage astrology' is worse than no astrology at all being published because it promotes singular attention to the Sun sign only. Of course there is merit in what you say in regard to the Solar perspective - but that and that alone is surely spiritually unhealthy... When you look at a garden and see the flowers all with only a single petal each... it doesn't look natural. It's the people that charge their entry fees to view the garden that I despise.
A.
Hey Apollo
V. interesting perspective - absolutely agree with you re your other post in aquacrystal's thread - everybody's got their own opinion, etc - but, again, v. interested in your point of view.
Excellent metaphor. I suppose I could extend it a bit to say that without the sun, there'd be no flowers in the garden at all(!) but of course agree with your point re concentration only on sun sign.
But do think, ironically enough, that the sun sign may be under-rated in serious astrology. (I'm thinking a lot about the sun sign and self-actualisation now, thanks in large part to your posts. Nothing like an opposing pov!) Am now thinking whole sun/sun sign thing more intricate and powerful than have thought before.
Like the way you put it re 'infinite possibilities to offer Humanity'. Don't know about infinite, but agree it certainly has soooo much to offer people that isn't taken up, thanks to its sidelining.
Don't want to ruffle any Christian feathers here, but one pov is that astrology (esp. regarding the sun) also v. v. v. important in the bible, both old and new testament, and can help to make sense of it, as well as of other symbols in life, as you prob. know. And, again as you know, can make us more understanding of where people are coming from/hopes/fears, etc (well, that's the theory!!!)
Great to see someone defending astrology - I seem to have spent a lot of time saying it's NOT rubbish, and explaining the importance of the whole horoscope, so makes nice change for me to be the one defending the sun sign!
Take care, and all the best!
In my more active younger years I used to defend astrology too - but took things a little more direct... I used to do a lot of study progressions and transits - I was pretty accurate with predictive work and built up a fairly good reputation. In those days there seemed to be a lot more parties... There was always the 'late night kitchen debate' and once I appeared on the scene someone would always have wee dig or jokey jibe at me... I used to laugh with everyone else - but always had the little ace card up my sleeve...
I'd put a wager to any skeptic present - that I could give predict an event in a person's life either in their future or even something major in their past - simply by having their time, place & date of birth... The wager was £100. - If I got it wrong my £100 would go to any charity... If I got it right ... my challenger would forfeit their £100 to any charity of my choice.
Strangely... nobody ever took up the challenge...:)
I had friends back then that were very up on the psychological stuff and they had tremendous insight into the personality... Myself - it was always either spiritual or prediction; that's all I was really into... Time used to fascinate me; I realized that 'time' wasn't and couldn't really be understood by ordinary consciousness; it's an illusion - albeit a perfectly controlled one.
I recall doing some work for a friend at the time. I remember he asked me about an event and what did I think was to happen at that time (can't remember what it was now:o...) and I timed the event exactly and the prediction was correct - he was happy & I added his case to my expanding file. However about a year later, I happened to go back through the case and realized a mistake in my calculations... making the timing of that event impossible to be correct... yet it was?! I looked at other cases and began to put together a perception that events are frequently due to happen (karmic jigsaw principle) at given moments in life and that sometimes you can be given the right 'tools' for defining that moment; even if one of the tools is incorrect... - time. I then developed a conclusion that time is fluid.
It was irrelevant that I had made the wrong calculation; the timing of the event and its passing was 'designed' - had I used the actual correct data I believe I would have still come up with the same time and event...
Infinite possibilities... maybe that's a touch of overstatement - but some people are pretty amazing in their work; medical astrologers for example...
A.
Having kept a daily diary for 30 years, I did a study of what points on my natal chart were being trasnited, and by which planets, on the most important days in my life. The natal sun was the point most commonly involved, followed by the Ascendant, followed by the other personal planets.
AS regards the long outer planet transits, transits to my natal sun eg Neptune conjunct natal sun, Pluto conjunct natal sun, have been very eventful, life-changing periods, but so equally have transits of Pluto and Uranus to my natal Venus, and Saturn and Pluto to my Ascendant. If I only looked at "Sun Sign Astrology", I could explain about 1/4 to 1/3 of the most memorable periods in my life. So I don't think Sun Sign Astrology is worthless, just very misleading if you think that's all there is to Astrology.
As regards what the Ancients did, I don't think we should assume they were right, anymore than we should assume that we "Moderns" always know better. You have to consider what Astrology was being used for in ancient times. Mainly it was to help kings in their policy decisions. More about obvious outward events, like people dying, rather than about internal things.
Ascendant is about how you relate to the world in general, and Descendant (which is precisely opposite) shows how the world responds. e.g. if you're Aries rising, the world keeps telling you to be more Libran!