Hi All
Just looking at Powderace's post and just in case you didn't know there is a yearly payment you can make in the UK that covers as many perscripitons as you require. I believe it costs £140 but once paid you can providing the doctor gives you the perscription of course, get them free.
I know this because a friend of mine does this.
Spine Elf
Thanks for the 'S' it makes me feel better 🙂
Powderace
You can also buy quarterly Pre Payment Certificate cards (PPC) for prescriptions which cost around £28.00, and can have as many prescriptions during that 3 month period as you need, at no extra cost. It can be a huge saving when you need regular prescriptions. I have just renewed my card and within days had 5 items prescribed by my GP so saved money immediately. You can apply online at:
[DLMURL] https://www.ppa.org.uk/ppa/ppcdd/patient.do [/DLMURL]
Maz
Hi Again all, Maz
Just an update to the advice I was so kindly given by mad-maz.I did call, and spoke to the clinic in question you recommended. After a brief chat, I was told that very few geographical areas will be NHS funded, and my area certainly isnt one of them.I was also advised that an operation would cost in the region of £10650 and I would have to raise this amount myself.They do not offer any financial assistance and even before that I have to pay £200 consultation plus £180 for an X-ray.Needless to say I am back at square one.As I have mentioned previously I am forced to work part time- get NO government assistance at all tax breaks etc and paying these fees are entirely out of the question.I have to say this condition seems permanent for those like myself who simply cannot afford correct treatments.Is this really the state of the NHS in the UK in 2010?....I wonder what on earth Ive been paying my national insurance for for all these years.Thanks for the initial promising lead with Dr Knight, but it appears it is another dead end...Any further suggestions most welcome.
Thanks again.P
I am very sorry to hear all of your sad stories from UK. Here in our country, 90% of all surgical procedures are covered by insurance.
If you think minimally-invasive surgery (like dr. Knight does), you can consider treatment abroad for far less price. Good luck.
Hi Powderace
Sorry to hear about your problems. You are probably correct in saying they started years ago.
I'm a similar age to you and grew up with the theory of wearing a support while weight training. Unless you are doing seriously heavy work I think these days most people suggest emphasising proper form and training without a belt, but include exercises to promote strong core muscles. Sit ups alone are not really enough for that.
I notice that you have mentioned strengthening your back and jogging. I would personally avoid jogging due to the impact. IMO Jogging is fairly inefficient way to strengthen your back, being primarily a cardio and leg stamina workout. You mention Pilates which is a far better option for strengthening your back. Although my personal favourite is a Flexi Bar, these devices were actually brought into the country for sale by Rebecca Small (a world renowned Step Instructor) after she had damaged a disc in her spine.
As I said in another recent post; most specialists recommend what they know/have been taught, and are sceptical regarding anything else. That doesn't mean other methods wont help you, but unfortunately it does mean listening to anacodotal reports and trying different approaches for yourself.
I am strong believer in the benefits of using devices such as the Nubax Trio or the Teeter inversion table. I was seeing an Osteopath weekly until I got my Teeter. After a month or two the pain had disappeared. I'm not alone as there are plenty of anecdotal accounts saying similar things.
Over the years my experiences suggest that common advice to build core fitness first, then work on functional strength but start slow is very sensible.
Hope that is of some help.
Pete
Hi PeteM01
Thanks for taking the time to read and understand where I am coming from. Im sure the regular long standing forum members have heard it all before, and I sincerely hope I do not come across as "here we go again" they think they have problems. I think I was rapidly growing tired, even depressed of the amount of generally fit and healthy people constantly telling how they understood my pain as they too have bad backs. My understanding (mainly due to the levels of pain and medical advice) is that the types of conditions on this forum and cauda equina problems in particular are not your bog standard every day run of the mill bad back issues?
This is genuinely the first time in 20 years I have felt I am talking to others who understand. Understand what its like being unable to put your own socks on without lying sideways on a bed. Understand not being able to tilt your neck in a shower to wash your hair without shooting pains that make you grit your teeth. Understand the embarrassing need of a grown man having to ask a neighbour to help lift him out of his car almost in tears due to the pain on a return trip from work.I wont even go into the effects and limitations it imposes on a persons sex life. I could go on, but you will mostly all know exactly what I am talking about. I thank the respondents and forum members again for the great advice offered thus far.
As I have stated not all of the advice is paying off though e.g. the expensive unaffordable operation. As amazing a fix as that may be, it might as well be offered on Mars, with my salary. But Maz, I thank you all the same. Hope and advice keeps myself and other forums members aware and informed of other possible avenues to look into, and we new members can ask no more.
PeteM...I have recently acquired an inversion table, but have been waiting until my back is up to the heavy assembly task it will involve. Soon - I hope.
I take on board what you say about the jogging and will generally heed your informed advice. I do intend to continue with some short light running - no hills, no real distances - as I have found it helps tremendously in other ways, mentally to strengthen my inner resilience whilst helping me focus against becoming little more then wheelchair bound at the age of 42.
My brother often says to me whenever I plan such fitness challenges, that I must be mad to want to do anything other than rest. Believe me though, I rest whenever and as much as I possible can because of this often debilitating condition. But I also refuse to be beaten by it as well. I was actually a fitness instructor for two years when this first occurred 20 years ago. I thought then that a quick operation with high success rates would be offered and was inevitable. I also thought with the right approach it could heal itself completely, like a skin cut you may pick up in the garden. Unfortunately this simply doesnt happen with our backs. It takes a lot of research and filtering, to find the best personal approach to your own condition -funding or no funding as it may be the case. The worst aspect (apart from the disabling pain) about this condition and other back problems is the masses of false leads you come across and follow on your own quest to get a resolution. The best move Ive made recently, is to join this forum.
I will continue with the Pilates, back support, volterol, diclofenix, co-dydramol and diazepam when I have to, but will remain open minded to new possibilities and advice, and I suggest others in my situation do the same.
I will try out my new inversion table shortly and I will keep trying to avoid the things that send me into a relapse. Holidays appear out though as last time I went abroad lifting a suitcase was the catalyst it needed to put me flat on my back in agony again. This condition can truly become a minefield of information that we have to tread very carefully and treat with masses of respect. I will certainly never be taking my back for granted again thats for sure, and I will stick to my limits when it comes to lifes little tasks, until I hopefully find a practical, affordable permanent fix.
Hi Powderace
I hope you get your table setup soon. When you do I suggest you start slow, laying with your head below your ankles takes a while to get used to. Most people find they get a 'head rush' when they start using a table and that can be disconcerting. Your body soon adapts though and after a few weeks most find they can invert to their desired angle without discomfort.
My suggestion is to preset the angle of inversion to the lowest setting for a week or two, with a Teeter that is 20 degrees, until you feel comfortable, then going to 40 degrees and 60 degrees. Try and use the table 2 or 3 times a day, specifically just after you wake up and just before you go to bed. Sleeping generally puts the less pressure on the spine than a normal day. So reducing the pressure on the spinal column is just before going to bed can mean the spine receives the maximum amount of pressure relief, together with the natural recuperative processes that occur during sleep.
When your on the table try and relax, breath deep and then 'sigh' to get the maximum muscle relaxation. Aim for spending 3 to 5 min like this. Always return upright slowly so gravity re-applies pressure to your discs gradually.
Hope that is of some help
Pete
hi,im new here and would like to tell you my story.in April of last year i started with pain in back,which got worse and worse.by july i couldnt move,the doctor sent me for mri scan.to my horror i had 4 prolapsed discs after seeing orthapedic surgeon he told me he could only repair one.i had the op,it took pain from my leg away but i still suffer back pain and numbness in my foot.this numbness causes me to fall over out of the blue.i worked all my life 33yrs and like all the rest of you paid tax and national insurance.in march of this year,my employer royal mail sacked me because of this.for the 1st time in my life i claimed benefits £64 esa allowance.i attended an assesment on march 31st with an atos nurse and scored 6pts.because i never got the 15 required my benefit has stopped,so for 33yrs of paying i now get nothing at all.i have motgage and bills like the rest of you all probably.what has happened to this country,how can a man with 3 prolapsed discs and falls over get another job,who will employ me.i sympathise with all you people who suffer with this condition,and i understand your pain.what baffles me is the surgeon has told me not to work yet an atos nurse says my condition is normal.
Hi Just read Robbie13's post. Sorry to hear of your troubles Robbie. I like many on this forum will fully understand the pain and discomfort you are in. Frustrations such as what you have discussed do nothing to help us get any better either. I had to drop my own working hours to part time and I have no chance of the employer ever letting me return to full time pay. I am slightly over the 15k threshold which stops me qualifying for any tax breaks and get no additional allowances or income apart from what I earn. Which isnt much. As I have stated many people must be in a situation where better and more successful treatments are available, but only to those who can find the funding. I had to remortgage my property twice just to keep the roof over my head and pay bills when my wages dropped, and my partner left a few years ago. I now have no equity left to remortgage again for a private operation (that SHOULD be available on the NHS).Most months of the year I have to hobble into work in agony. I have indeed looked into DHS benefits options instead of working as I often ask myself is it worth the pain?. They basically said If I leave the job I will get nothing and its unlikely Id qualify for any other benefits for my back as I can usually walk. I may be able to walk (sometimes) but never without pain and I am severely limited to what I can do on a day to day basis. I had to take my own employer to an industrial tribunal just to get my hours dropped. I won that battle, and at least I was covered by the disability discrimination act to assist my request.
I find it disgraceful that you tried to get the just and rightly deserved benefit rewards for someone in your condition, and this has now been refused. I know of many people who travel abroad frequently, enjoy expensive shopping trips and all on the basis they are depressed or stressed. They get bills, rent and additional allowances to allow them to fund this lifestyle. The likes of you and me struggle to make even ends meet. The system for caring and treating severe back conditions on the NHS has turned me against this institution and big brother bureaucracy.
Sadly, I recently had to watch my father suffer for months with cancer in the NHS and the palliative care was attrocious.Even the normal nurses at the hospital had to be begged for any little extra help such as some dignity to allow him to die in peace without loud noises, smells and visitors for other patients all around him. This shocked me into realizing that many NHS staff have little empathy towards the sick and dying when their own jobs become mundane and coldly automatic. I understand that they cannot become emotionally involved ( I have two nurses as friends) but the coldness towards patients I watched was to my utter horror and sadness that will stay with me forever. I fully understand its a very difficult job and not healthcare workers are like this, but if you cant be sympathetic and have to stay detached to the levels I witnessed - then Im sorry nurses - but youre definitely in the wrong job. Leave treating paitients to the nurses who see people as real, feeling individuals, with families -just like you- who deserve constant 24hr respectful care.
I now dread having to be in an NHS hospital in my final months when my own time comes around.
So overall my experiences of the health care systems, doctors, specialists and benefits over the last few years in the UK have been very depressing.
I hope you too find alternative cheaper ways to strengthen up your back like I have had to, and the relapses arent too often. The inversion table is my current best hope and as with pain killers, Pilates, back lumbar support, a good posture chair at home and devils claw anti-inflams. Best wishes to you and others in the same situation to get your disability recognized for what it genuinely is.
Powderace
Powderace,like you i have lost all faith in the system and what it is ment to stand for.I am so sorry to hear of your troubles,and as daft as this sounds,when you read this site its so glad to know your not alone.Is it me or do the docs and specialist make you feel like your imagining the pain or discomfort etc..I only wish they could have one day in our shoes,maybe they would understand better then,how this affects our lives and causes us stress and how the quality of our lives has slipped through no fault of are own.
Hi everyone im new to this message board but I suffered a prolapsed disc L4/L5 (which seems quick common) about four weeks ago. Had a massive spasm leaving a lot of my back muscles in a bad way and needing an ambulance!! I had a bit of a rough time in AandE and left with a bag of very strong pills and no follow up!
I am very lucky that I have BUPA cover as many have noted and I was in straight away to my GP and then off for a scan and the results to confirm the above. I have had some really good progress in this short time and I wanted to share how I had done it.
Firstly started stretching (4-5 times a day), mainly floor exercises (toe touching, stretching sides) including the leg area as much as my back.
built up to walking for about 10-15 minutes round the block.
to be honest the stretching helped ease a lot of the pain as I felt that the muscles around the area has tightened up so hard to protect the disc, however this was causing other problems such as tight groin muscles, thigh and hamstrings which again was really painful.
I started yesterday on the exercise bike as its getting cold out (which doesnt help with movement!!) but i felt a little weak round my spine and around my hips so I started trawling the internet to see if there wer any supports that could help and I decided to purchase a couple of items for the house that would hopefully ease my problems.
I did this as I had been drilled by my specialist that posture was the reason for my problem and it had built up of time (6 years in a desk/car based job) and I couldnt asses if my posture was right or not without looking in the mirror or being shown?
I bought a posture correcting chair (which is ok but not made things massively easier however i think it will prevent further instances) and a back support which is amazing (a bit pricey but has really helped me) the link is here http://bit.ly/8XqIBn the strap is quite tight but keeps my posture right when on the bike and walking about it also helps supprt the muscles at the top of my hips.
I really wasnt keen on it at first but was pushed by a willing girlfriend to do everything I could so in for a penny and all that!! I can now do quite a bit more exercise than I did and it seems to have helped with the pain aswell. I hope this was useful, happy to share stretches that I do if anyone wants to message me. or if anyone has any really affective exercise for around the rib area I would love to know!
best and good health
..... a back support which is amazing (a bit pricey but has really helped me) the link is here http://bit.ly/8XqIBn the strap is quite tight but keeps my posture right when on the bike and walking about it also helps supprt the muscles at the top of my hips.
Wow that is pricey at £61.99, I got mine from screwfix, and although I gove mine over 10 years ago, they're still only £13.29. 😉
Myarka
It's ups and downs Marie
Hi Marie
I was in your position a few years ago and have lived with a prolapsed disc L4/L5. The pain in the beginning was unbelievably bad. I will try to tell you my experience.
At New Years 2008 I was helping my daughter and her boyfriend move into their new place. I was lifting and carrying as you do. I started to feel a strain in my back like anyone. I realised it was a sign and took it easy. Within less than a week, I began to feel the pain shift from being a "strain" to sciatica. I tried to cope with it as best as I could.
In Feb I joined a gym to see if I could work out the pain or improve my health or what ever. I went every night and every night it hurt. I was going very slow on the machines as I was very unfit anyway. By mid March I was unable to cope any longer and went to my GP. He prescribed Oramorph, 5-10mg every six hours. I did this and it helped to the total of zero. I went back the following day in tears and saw one of the locums. He said ok, take it every hour until you feel relief. I did this and it did work and I slept a lot.
Oh, the GP also signed me off for about 2 weeks at the outset. This then became about 8 weeks in the end. His approach and it is the general approach with a prolapsed disc, is to do nothing but treat with pain medicine. While I was off from work the first time I was prescribed MST (Morphine, 12 hour lasting) which worked quite well. Didnt work 100% but I also had the Oramorph to top up on. also, Diclophenac.
Things didn't get better as such but the pain was under control. It took until May before I had an MRI. This frightened the life out of me. I was fine until I saw how close the top of the MRI was to my face. I felt like I was going into a tiny confined hole. I felt serious claustrophobia. I am not normally inclined but this freaked me out big time. Once in, and after a few minutes I was ok. Any way... after that I was referred to a surgeon. He said he was happy to operate. I was given a date and went in for preop. As the case with a vast majority of disc problems they tend to begin to recover around about 6 months.
As this was the case with me, I was without pain by the time they went to operate, so I put off having the surgery. My problem has been that it will go through a cycle where I have very bad pain which leaves me debilitated. Then they offer surgery, surgery takes a good few months to get a surgery date, and by the time you get a date, you are no longer in pain. At least that was my issue. I am now almost 3 years down the road, been offered surgery 3 times now. Cancelled twice and am scheduled for the 16th of Dec 2010. I spoke to my surgeon and he understands and is very supportive.
I will not be cancelling this time because I have had so many problems with relapsing. The latest episode I was very close to suicide. In May of this year I was having trouble. I have not been on the MST since 2008. Other episodes have been treated with Oramorph or this year it was a combination of Tramadol, gabapentin & diclophenac suppositories (as they are supposed to work better, and I think they are a little better) This was not as helpful as the morphine. It left me so sleepy I was falling asleep at my desk at work.
I took a week off from work and for the entire week I bet I slept an average of 2 hours a day. I didnt sleep at night. I became paranoid. I began worrying about sufficating. I went to bed and felt closed in and as if I could not breath well. I was very close to killing myself. I rang the duty dr at the NHS and he suggested that I come off of the tramadol. He thought it was the cause to my mental issues. I suffered so much. I finally went back to the Dr and said I wanted to be back on the Oramorph and it was a good idea. I don't fall asleep now like I did. It is easier to take.
I am not (as I mentioned) waiting for surgery on the 16th of December. I am worried to some degree as my pain is not just pain down my leg. I also have some numbness in my foot as well. But I have a lot of pain in my back, from my spine travelling the path of the sciatic nerve through my buttocks and into my leg. I sometimes feel leg pain but I keep telling myself that the leg doesnt start at the bottom of the torso and that the back is just the spine. I hope that when the pain leaves the spine it is then travelling the length of the sciatic nerve. I do have considerable bulging which has not improved. I do have pain which varies in severity depending on my movements and position.
If I have been sitting poorly or walking too long, or something like that, then I get more pain. My fear is that it will return again. I don't think that I am one of those that will really get much better without surgery. The medical profession says that a vast majority improve after 6 months. Out of the % that improve, another % have another episode. With each episode a smaller % reoccur. After 3 years they reckon that most are about as good as those who had surgery early.
So, this is not good for me as I may not be much better. also they say that sometimes the pain gets worse or the nerve is damaged and takes even longer to improve. So, I will try to update either again before surgery or at least after so I can give all of the details. I couldnt find anyones experience who gave the level of detail I wanted to know. I wanted to know things like how does it feel from the operation? What is that like. What are you able/not able to do immediately after? What is it like getting in and out of bed, using the toilet, walking up the stairs to bed, using a laptop? How does it feel after a week? What will I feel like at each stage? I want to know... it all.
Please let me know if any of this was helpful or if anyone has any questions they think I might be able to assist with. I would love to be able to pass on some of my info to someone else. 🙂
I do hope you have had a recent mri and they aren't operating off an old one as it sounds like you have ongoing problems that are changing your pain.
What operation are they going to do as all the questions you ask seem to revolve around after, and not a care about the actual form the operation will take? That affects the after more than anything else!