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TheMortalOne
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Why do some christians Think that people hate them because they are christians? Are they sure it's their religion? couldn't it be something personal instead?
The thing is. I know this woman who thinks people hate her because she is a christian. No one can change her mind about it. However, as far as I am concerned. This woman has issues from childhood that she doesn't want to admit.

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Amber
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My guess is that each individual who believes they are being persecuted as a result of their religion or beliefs will have a different explanation as to why they think this is happening, which is personal to them.

Some might actually really be experiencing hostility as a result of what they choose to believe or how they choose to live their lives.

And for others it is a case of ego.

And then I guess there are some who might have mental health issues.

I don't think anybody here can speak for the person you are referring to, since it would be impossible to know for sure without knowing her and her situation.

If she does have 'issues' like you think, then maybe she just needs support and understanding from friends and people who are close to her.

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Energylz
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Why do some christians Think that people hate them because they are christians? Are they sure it's their religion? couldn't it be something personal instead?
The thing is. I know this woman who thinks people hate her because she is a christian. No one can change her mind about it. However, as far as I am concerned. This woman has issues from childhood that she doesn't want to admit.

If your car breaks down and you feel anger at the car, you cannot blame the car for the anger you feel, the anger is being created within.
If this woman feels that people are hating her for her religion, then this is not because people are imparting that feeling on her, it is because that feeling is coming from within herself.
When one realises where feelings come from, then one can do something about it, but while one believes that feelings are being put into them by something external to themselves, they will fail to see the truth and fail to know how to correct it.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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TheMortalOne
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If your car breaks down and you feel anger at the car, you cannot blame the car for the anger you feel, the anger is being created within.
If this woman feels that people are hating her for her religion, then this is not because people are imparting that feeling on her, it is because that feeling is coming from within herself.
When one realises where feelings come from, then one can do something about it, but while one believes that feelings are being put into them by something external to themselves, they will fail to see the truth and fail to know how to correct it.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

I totally agree. But I have seen many christians who feel that way. They feel that everyone is against them because they are christians. This is crazy. I personally don't know anyone who would hate someone because of their religion.

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Energylz
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I personally don't know anyone who would hate someone because of their religion.

Not personally, no, but just look at many terrorists and how they feel about others beliefs.

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Stephen100
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I am someone who has noticed hatred towards those just for being Christian. I have seen atheists go to Christian channels and start posting hatred and attacking people for their beliefs. Atheists don't seem bothered in attacking Muslims, but they sure do love to attack Christians.

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Energylz
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I am someone who has noticed hatred towards those just for being Christian. I have seen atheists go to Christian channels and start posting hatred and attacking people for their beliefs. Atheists don't seem bothered in attacking Muslims, but they sure do love to attack Christians.

Perhaps you could clarify what you mean by an atheist?

As an atheist myself, I feel you're being a little judgemental (and attacking) against me, and yet I do not choose to attack anyone of any faith. So why do you feel you can label me as some who chooses to attack christians?

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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Stephen100
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Perhaps you could clarify what you mean by an atheist?

As an atheist myself, I feel you're being a little judgemental (and attacking) against me, and yet I do not choose to attack anyone of any faith. So why do you feel you can label me as some who chooses to attack christians?

All Love and Reiki Hugs

Thanks for your reply. I didn't say EVERY atheist, but many atheists have indeed attacked Christians for their beliefs, just out of hatred. I'm not judging you personally, and I never did. I was pointing out that there are indeed atheists who have a hatred towards Christians.

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Energylz
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When you said:

Atheists don't seem bothered in attacking Muslims, but they sure do love to attack Christians.

you were including all atheists with that wording.

I have met Christians, Catholics, Muslims and others who have had a hatred toward atheists and other faiths.

It doesn't matter what faith a person has, the hatred comes from the individual, not the true faith.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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Stephen100
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When you said:

you were including all atheists with that wording.

I have met Christians, Catholics, Muslims and others who have had a hatred toward atheists and other faiths.

It doesn't matter what faith a person has, the hatred comes from the individual, not the true faith.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

Not true. I never said all atheists. And whether or not you have met Christians, Catholics, or Muslims who have hatred towards atheists to changing the subject. We wasn't talking about other people, we were talking about atheists.

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Energylz
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Not true. I never said all atheists.

Your sentance started "Atheists..." which intimated you were grouping all atheist into that statement. It didn't say "Some atheists...". That was your wording, not mine.

And whether or not you have met Christians, Catholics, or Muslims who have hatred towards atheists to changing the subject. We wasn't talking about other people, we were talking about atheists.

No, the topic of the thread is about a person who feels they are hated because of their faith, not specifically about Atheists, so I certainly am not going off-topic. You made a outright statement that atheists don't seem bothered in attacking muslims, but love to attack christians, and that statement appears to be based on some bias of your own, because I know I have seen people of various faiths attacking others, and that includes atheists showing hatred towards muslims. I don't see that there is any way you can make a general statement about any one particular faith showing hatred toward any other one particular faith in favour of others, when the hatred comes from individuals, and not from the true meaning of the faith with which they may be grouped within.

What evidence are you basing your statement on, that Atheists 'love' to attack christians but are not bothered in attacking muslims?

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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Stephen100
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Your sentance started "Atheists..." which intimated you were grouping all atheist into that statement. It didn't say "Some atheists...". That was your wording, not mine.

No, the topic of the thread is about a person who feels they are hated because of their faith, not specifically about Atheists, so I certainly am not going off-topic. You made a outright statement that atheists don't seem bothered in attacking muslims, but love to attack christians, and that statement appears to be based on some bias of your own, because I know I have seen people of various faiths attacking others, and that includes atheists showing hatred towards muslims. I don't see that there is any way you can make a general statement about any one particular faith showing hatred toward any other one particular faith in favour of others, when the hatred comes from individuals, and not from the true meaning of the faith with which they may be grouped within.

What evidence are you basing your statement on, that Atheists 'love' to attack christians but are not bothered in attacking muslims?

All Love and Reiki Hugs

I never said all atheists, but the majority of them, when attacking religion, do seem to have a special hatred for Christianity. I can only go by experience.

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Tashanie
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I never said all atheists, but the majority of them, when attacking religion, do seem to have a special hatred for Christianity. I can only go by experience.

Actually most people I know who are anti religion are anti ALL religions. My husband although spiritual (he is a medium) feels religon has been the casue of ore wars than anything else.

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Stephen100
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Actually most people I know who are anti religion are anti ALL religions. My husband although spiritual (he is a medium) feels religon has been the casue of ore wars than anything else.

My point is that most atheists attack Christianity more than any other religion, in my experience. Atheists have also killed more people in history than all religions combined.

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Reiki Pixie
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I never said all atheists, but the majority of them, when attacking religion, do seem to have a special hatred for Christianity. I can only go by experience.

My point is that most atheists attack Christianity more than any other religion, in my experience. Atheists have also killed more people in history than all religions combined.

The reason that Athiest may seem to attack Christianity over other religions is that most Atheists live in Christian countries like the UK and have been brought up to be Christians. As people who have often been influenced by Christian culture, they have a better right to criticize the country and culture they live in.

As a general comment about religion and war, personally I don't buy into the idea that religion/s create war. Wars are power struggles over land, wealth, resources and trade routes. But what better way (especially in the past) to rally the "masses" by saying murdering others in war is God's Will and such nonsense.

RP

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Energylz
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Atheists have also killed more people in history than all religions combined.

Please, do share where you have the statistical facts to back this up... I've never come across any real evidence myself.

Perhaps you are referring to things like this...

[url]Atheists are responsible for much more Murder, Rape and Genocide - YouTube[/url]

.. from a person who clearly is giving an unbiased opinion... erm... not.

Perhaps this person has a better way of looking at it..

[url]Who Kills More, Religion or Atheism?[/url]

So I am no longer going to participate in the childish debate of what religion has killed more people in history, because it doesn't matter. The way I see it, you might as well debate what color underpants are worn by the largest number of killers, and try to draw a causal relationship there as well. Religion does not cause you to kill people, and it certainly doesn't prevent you from killing people. Let's stop pretending that it does either.

... which sums it up nicely I think.

So, if 1 atheist goes and kills one million people, or 750,000 non-atheists (whatever religion you choose) go and kill 1 person each, which group of people are you going to classify as having killed the most people in history. According to yourself, this is likely to be the Atheists as more people were killed, yet in reality it was one person who did the killing whilst you choose to label them all as killers, and also choose to ignore the 750,000 non-atheist killers.

You see, it's all nonsense... you cannot judge a classification of people, such as atheists as being more murderous than another classification of people, simply by the number of people killed... because at the end of the day, it's not the faith or non-faith that kills people, it's the individuals, and to judge a whole classification of people based on the actions of some, is wrong, regardless of their beliefs.

From what you've said so far, it would seem you have some sort of personal issue with Atheists, and you feel that atheists are somehow terrible people out to get Christians.

Tashanie is absolutely correct, those individuals who are fundamentally anti-religion do not tend to discriminate about which religion they choose to attack, but remember that 'anti-religion' can also be 'anti-their-own-religion' as some religious fanatics will attack anyone who is not of their own faith, and I say 'some' specifically, because it is those individuals, not usually the whole class of people in that faith, most of whom are generally tolerant and kind people who are happy to go about their own faith and beliefs and leave others to theirs.

And Reiki Pixie makes a very valid point. Many atheists grow up in christian oriented societies, as many other religious societies have a firmer hold on their children growing up and being indoctrinated (in a non offensive sense) with their religious beliefs.

It's a shame to see someone feel they are able to judge in such a way as to say in such a generalization of a way that "atheists [..] sure do love to attack christians" and "most atheists attack christianity more than any other religion" and "athiests have killed more people in history than all religions combined". This, unfortunately, doesn't come across as being a non-judgemental christian way of living as I understand christianity teaches.

When I attended Roman Catholic school (and yes I did that as an Atheists for two years), it was good to be accepted by the priest during their Religious education lessons, for which I had been told by the headmaster that I did not need to attend these lessons if I didn't want to. At the end of the two years, the priest came to me and thanked me for attending the lessons because, he said, I had allowed the other pupils to actually see the discussions from another viewpoint, rather than them just accepting the teachings of their church. Yet some of those pupils were not so kind themselves...(something I think I've mentioned before a few years ago on these forums)... One of them approached me out of the blue and said to me "I don't know how you can be an Atheist, you could go out there and kill someone and not feel guilty about it". This took me aback somewhat, that someone could have the opinion that because I was an atheist I would feel no guilt if I had killed someone, and was curious how his religious teachings had led him to believe that. I replied to this person "Let me assure you, if I killed someone, I am very sure that I would feel guilty about it, but let me put it to you, that you could kill someone, go to confession, be told to say 100 hail mary's [your penance] and receive the forgiveness of God to absolve you of your guilt and sins". To this he had no reply... perhaps he had a moment of enlightenment about what he had said to me, I don't know, though he never apologized for his rash judgement of me, yet I feel no malice towards him, as I recognise this was his own ignorance clouded by the teachings that his faith is the only true faith, and having no firm understanding of other beliefs or non-beliefs.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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Stephen100
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Please, do share where you have the statistical facts to back this up... I've never come across any real evidence myself.

Perhaps you are referring to things like this...

[url]Atheists are responsible for much more Murder, Rape and Genocide - YouTube[/url]

.. from a person who clearly is giving an unbiased opinion... erm... not.

Perhaps this person has a better way of looking at it..

[url]Who Kills More, Religion or Atheism?[/url]

... which sums it up nicely I think.

So, if 1 atheist goes and kills one million people, or 750,000 non-atheists (whatever religion you choose) go and kill 1 person each, which group of people are you going to classify as having killed the most people in history. According to yourself, this is likely to be the Atheists as more people were killed, yet in reality it was one person who did the killing whilst you choose to label them all as killers, and also choose to ignore the 750,000 non-atheist killers.

You see, it's all nonsense... you cannot judge a classification of people, such as atheists as being more murderous than another classification of people, simply by the number of people killed... because at the end of the day, it's not the faith or non-faith that kills people, it's the individuals, and to judge a whole classification of people based on the actions of some, is wrong, regardless of their beliefs.

From what you've said so far, it would seem you have some sort of personal issue with Atheists, and you feel that atheists are somehow terrible people out to get Christians.

Tashanie is absolutely correct, those individuals who are fundamentally anti-religion do not tend to discriminate about which religion they choose to attack, but remember that 'anti-religion' can also be 'anti-their-own-religion' as some religious fanatics will attack anyone who is not of their own faith, and I say 'some' specifically, because it is those individuals, not usually the whole class of people in that faith, most of whom are generally tolerant and kind people who are happy to go about their own faith and beliefs and leave others to theirs.

And Reiki Pixie makes a very valid point. Many atheists grow up in christian oriented societies, as many other religious societies have a firmer hold on their children growing up and being indoctrinated (in a non offensive sense) with their religious beliefs.

It's a shame to see someone feel they are able to judge in such a way as to say in such a generalization of a way that "atheists [..] sure do love to attack christians" and "most atheists attack christianity more than any other religion" and "athiests have killed more people in history than all religions combined". This, unfortunately, doesn't come across as being a non-judgemental christian way of living as I understand christianity teaches.

When I attended Roman Catholic school (and yes I did that as an Atheists for two years), it was good to be accepted by the priest during their Religious education lessons, for which I had been told by the headmaster that I did not need to attend these lessons if I didn't want to. At the end of the two years, the priest came to me and thanked me for attending the lessons because, he said, I had allowed the other pupils to actually see the discussions from another viewpoint, rather than them just accepting the teachings of their church. Yet some of those pupils were not so kind themselves...(something I think I've mentioned before a few years ago on these forums)... One of them approached me out of the blue and said to me "I don't know how you can be an Atheist, you could go out there and kill someone and not feel guilty about it". This took me aback somewhat, that someone could have the opinion that because I was an atheist I would feel no guilt if I had killed someone, and was curious how his religious teachings had led him to believe that. I replied to this person "Let me assure you, if I killed someone, I am very sure that I would feel guilty about it, but let me put it to you, that you could kill someone, go to confession, be told to say 100 hail mary's [your penance] and receive the forgiveness of God to absolve you of your guilt and sins". To this he had no reply... perhaps he had a moment of enlightenment about what he had said to me, I don't know, though he never apologized for his rash judgement of me, yet I feel no malice towards him, as I recognise this was his own ignorance clouded by the teachings that his faith is the only true faith, and having no firm understanding of other beliefs or non-beliefs.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

I didn't bother reading everything you said because nearly straight away I noticed that you were telling a pack of lies.

Peace

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Energylz
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I didn't bother reading everything you said because nearly straight away I noticed that you were telling a pack of lies.

Peace

Clearly you haven't read it then. I would certainly like you to indicate where I am "telling a pack of lies". I consider it very rude to accuse someone else of being a liar and such accusations are not in line with the way things are discussed on these forums.

These are a place for friendly discussion, so perhaps you'd like to refer to the forum guidelines...

Language:
Any foul or hostile language used will not be tolerated. This includes any derogatory statements and profanity. Direct or indirect personal attacks are strictly not permitted. Insults and negative attitudes are not allowed. Saying you don't agree and why, can be done in a good humoured and polite way without causing offence.

All members have the right to their own ideas, beliefs and faiths. Members have the right to express these with equal respect and consideration.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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Stephen100
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Clearly you haven't read it then. I would certainly like you to indicate where I am "telling a pack of lies". I consider it very rude to accuse someone else of being a liar and such accusations are not in line with the way things are discussed on these forums.

These are a place for friendly discussion, so perhaps you'd like to refer to the forum guidelines...

All Love and Reiki Hugs

I'm sorry, but I don't waste my time debating liars. It's not worth it.

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WildStrawberry
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Clearly you haven't read it then. I would certainly like you to indicate where I am "telling a pack of lies". I consider it very rude to accuse someone else of being a liar and such accusations are not in line with the way things are discussed on these forums.

These are a place for friendly discussion, so perhaps you'd like to refer to the forum guidelines...

All Love and Reiki Hugs

Giles,

I've had a couple of run-ins with you on this forum, with you accusing me of being rude. And, of course, if you perceive rudeness and choose not to tolerate it, will you please explain to me why?

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CarolineN
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I'm sorry, but I don't waste my time debating liars. It's not worth it.

Stephen

In no way is Energyls a liar. Just because your ideas don't coincide with his is no way to make accusations like that. Bigotry unfortunately is very common in those who are utterly convinced in their line of thought. It doesn't make for good debate.

Unfortunately with beliefs in the spiritual world - however it is put, whatever the belief - nothing can be proved scientically. It is up to trust and belief. Each person is different. Their experiences and education are different. So each person's perceptions are different. Jumping up and down and shouting and calling people liars isn't going to make anyone else come to your perception however fervent a person is.

My perceptions have changed through my life experiences. My ideas about the spirit world are a whole host different from say 25 years ago. Each person can, if they choose, follow their own pathway, or stick with the 'crowd', whatever that crowd is.

Jesus followed his own path and others took up the 'flag' with and after him, putting their own interpretation on their perceptions, so the Christianity that was set up by the Council of Nicea in 325AD by the Emperor Constantine produced a somewhat different perception from what the immediate followers of Jesus did or had in mind (see the Nag Hammadi tractates). Constantine needed to unify the Empire - they voted as to what would be acceptable for this new pandemic religion, one that all could follow. Look it up and read in detail how it was worked together. It is a product of people's perceptions, and has changed and continues to change over the centuries.

However fervent one's belief you cannot PROVE God exists or not. You can only believe.

Stephen, please sit back and try to think more clearly before blasting people off.

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Energylz
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Hi WS

Giles,

I've had a couple of run-ins with you on this forum, with you accusing me of being rude. And, of course, if you perceive rudeness and choose not to tolerate it, will you please explain to me why?

Not sure I'd say we've personally had 'run-ins'... that seems such a negative view on things, and I know you have a lot of valuable views to add to discussions here. Sometimes, people post things that do appear to be rude. Sometimes it's not obvious as to the source of the perception of rudeness, as people often forget that we, as moderators, get things reported to us by other members who feel they are being attacked or whatever by some other member, and then it's up to us moderators to evaluate the situation and communicate with the person in question if necessary to try and alleviate things, simply because we want the forum to run smoothly and retain it's friendly atmosphere, accepting that some discussions can become heated within reason. Unfortunately, some people take that to mean that the moderator in question is the one who has the issue, even if the moderating team have collectively agreed on the course of action needed (and trust me, most of the moderating team, past and present, have experienced one member or another who's gone waaaay off the handle and almost literally wanted to shoot the messenger as if it's something personal).

In this particular case however, I'm discussing things as any other member, and would expect all due respect as laid down in the forum guidelines. To be outright called a liar, at the same time as indicating that the discussion has not been read, comes across as a breach of those forum guidelines, and therefore unneccessarily rude. There's certainly nothing friendly in accusing someone of "telling a pack of lies" and to now be called a liar a second time even when, personally, I'm attempting to discuss things in a friendly manner. The people who know me after my many years of being on this forum, will be well aware that I don't lie, I simply put forward points for discussion, yet there will always be someone who, sadly, feels they have a right to judge others and be rude about them on a public forum. That's a shame, as it certainly could have been an interesting discussion, and I'd love to know what Stephen believes I have said that is a lie. Can you see where I may have lied?

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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WildStrawberry
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Caroline, I'm not particularly addressing my comments towards you with what follows, but using your post to bounce of to make a couple of points.:)

In no way is Energyls a liar. Just because your ideas don't coincide with his is no way to make accusations like that. Bigotry unfortunately is very common in those who are utterly convinced in their line of thought. It doesn't make for good debate.

When someone calls another person a bigot or accuses them of bigotry, this statement seems to me to have an inherent intolerance in itself - making it a bigoted statement in itself: Being intolerant of the intolerant πŸ™‚ . (As I said Caroline, I am not pointing any fingers, just making a point.)

Unfortunately with beliefs in the spiritual world - however it is put, whatever the belief - nothing can be proved scientically. It is up to trust and belief. Each person is different. Their experiences and education are different. So each person's perceptions are different. Jumping up and down and shouting and calling people liars isn't going to make anyone else come to your perception however fervent a person is.

Caroline and Giles, if someone came to you for advice regarding a difficulty (Stephen has said that going by his personal experience Christians have) they were having and you were helping them out with EFT (or reiki, or whatever). If that person was "jumping up and down and shouting" would you take it personally - judge them for jumping up and down and shouting and in turn call them rude or bigoted? Or, would you say, alright then, lets examine what underlying emotions are causing you to jump up and down and shout?

Btw, Stephen I know you haven't asked for any help, I'm making a point - you're entitled to your views, I'm not suggesting that they're wrenched out of your hands with Reiki or EFT session.

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Energylz
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Caroline and Giles, if someone came to you for advice regarding a difficulty (Stephen has said that going by his personal experience Christians have) they were having and you were helping them out with EFT (or reiki, or whatever). If that person was "jumping up and down and shouting" would you take it personally - judge them for jumping up and down and shouting and in turn call them rude or bigoted? Or, would you say, alright then, lets examine what underlying emotions are causing you to jump up and down and shout?

The difference being that the person has not come to us seeking assistance, they are partaking in discussion. On top of that I have asked Stephen to point out where he considers me to have lied, so that I can understand what he means, but his reponse is just that he won't debate [with?] liars... which gets us nowhere. How can we have a healthy discussion about something when one side of the floor doesn't want to discuss? Likewise if a client comes to us for treatment but refuses to explain, then there's typically very little the practitioner can do to assist.

I can understand that Stephen's personal experience is that Christians are seemingly, to him, attacked by Atheists more than the Atheists attack other faiths, but would question if he actually has experience of the other faiths and how much they feel attacked by Atheists, or indeed attacked by other faiths? I'm certainly not here to lie to anybody, and I'm involved in the discussion to increase my knowledge and understanding, for those who wish to discuss and share. Obviously, Stephen has taken umbrage at something I've said, though now refuses to allow us to understand what that may be.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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WildStrawberry
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There's certainly nothing friendly in accusing someone of "telling a pack of lies" and to now be called a liar a second time even when, personally, I'm attempting to discuss things in a friendly manner. The people who know me after my many years of being on this forum, will be well aware that I don't lie, I simply put forward points for discussion, yet there will always be someone who, sadly, feels they have a right to judge others and be rude about them on a public forum. That's a shame, as it certainly could have been an interesting discussion, and I'd love to know what Stephen believes I have said that is a lie. Can you see where I may have lied?

Personally, I don't see anything friendly in calling someone rude - I really don't, I have actual confusion around the point as I'm writing this (it's literally making my head hurt, trying to grasp it). At the same time, I'm not making any judgements about you.

No, I can't see where you've lied. You often use the car analogy: A car can't make a person angry (or whatever) only individual can (ie, the anger is coming from the person not the car):

Stephen is reading (glancing over) your post [your post = the car] ---> leading to Stephen reaction.

You are reading Stephen response to your post, calling you a liar [being called a liar = the car], ---> leading to you perceiving rudeness and being offended by that.

....I know this is off-topic.

But, whether it's the Bible; Christianity; being attacked by other for your beliefs; whatever - all of those topics are essentially THE CAR.

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NICE_1
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I'm certainly not here to lie to anybody .

Would you swear to that under oath Giles . πŸ˜€

Perhaps a lie detector test is needed .. In a public arena or via a live webcam link . πŸ˜€

( Always found you to be fair and respectful in your expression Giles )

x dazzle x

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WildStrawberry
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The difference being that the person has not come to us seeking assistance, they are partaking in discussion. On top of that I have asked Stephen to point out where he considers me to have lied, so that I can understand what he means, but his reponse is just that he won't debate [with?] liars... which gets us nowhere. How can we have a healthy discussion about something when one side of the floor doesn't want to discuss? Likewise if a client comes to us for treatment but refuses to explain, then there's typically very little the practitioner can do to assist.

I can understand that Stephen's personal experience is that Christians are seemingly, to him, attacked by Atheists more than the Atheists attack other faiths, but would question if he actually has experience of the other faiths and how much they feel attacked by Atheists, or indeed attacked by other faiths? I'm certainly not here to lie to anybody, and I'm involved in the discussion to increase my knowledge and understanding, for those who wish to discuss and share. Obviously, Stephen has taken umbrage at something I've said, though now refuses to allow us to understand what that may be.

I get what your saying, I really do. But if someone is reluctant to speak, then in my experience, calling them rude or bigoted is hardly the way to create an non-judgmental arena that engenders open debate. (And, I'm not judging you or Caroline).

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Energylz
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Personally, I don't see anything friendly in calling someone rude - I really don't, I have actual confusion around the point as I'm writing this (it's literally making my head hurt, trying to grasp it). At the same time, I'm not making any judgements about you.

I know you're not. I wasn't actually calling Stephen rude, I said that I consider him calling me a liar to be rude, and the "I consider" is certainly my own perception of what he has said, and that is in line with the car analogy (it was an analogy used by one of my Buddhist teachers for the record πŸ˜‰ ). I recognise that the perception of rudeness is my own, and as such do not allow it to effect me in this moment, but felt that, in the interests of trying to keep the discussion friendly on the forums for everyone, Stephen should have it pointed out to him that what he is saying can be construed that way, so that he can realise that this forum is not like others he may have been on (he mentioned "Christian Channels" in his first post on this thread), and that people here want to discuss things in a friendly manner and there is no need for such defensiveness and certainly no place for accusing someone of being a liar without sufficient justifcation.

No, I can't see where you've lied. You often use the car analogy: A car can't make a person angry (or whatever) only individual can (ie, the anger is coming from the person not the car):

Stephen is reading (glancing over) your post [your post = the car] ---> leading to Stephen reaction.

I don't think it was the car post that Stephen had issue with, perhaps more the posts that followed that perhaps challenge his own beliefs or understandings.

You are reading Stephen response to your post, calling you a liar [being called a liar = the car], ---> leading to you perceiving rudeness and being offended by that.

Not offended no, just recognising what is being said and how people will perceive it. If it were not pointed out that calling someone a liar is rude, then others would come to the forums expecting they can go around making such accusations or name-calling of others, and that doesn't fit in with the forum guidelines in respect of friendly discussion.

....I know this is off-topic.

Not completely, as I feel it relates to people's feelings towards others of different faiths.

But, whether it's the Bible; Christianity; being attacked by other for your beliefs; whatever - all of those topics are essentially THE CAR.

Yes.

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Energylz
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Would you swear to that under oath Giles . πŸ˜€

Perhaps a lie detector test is needed .. In a public arena or via a live webcam link . πŸ˜€

Yes, I would swear to that. I have no intention to lie. If I do say something that is a lie, then it is unintentional, and I would love to have it pointed out so that I can change my understanding and knowledge.

( Always found you to be fair and respectful in your expression Giles )

Many thanks Daz, you yourself show great fairness and respect too.

All Love and Reiki Hugs

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WildStrawberry
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I know you're not. I wasn't actually calling Stephen rude, I said that I consider him calling me a liar to be rude, and the "I consider" is certainly my own perception of what he has said, and that is in line with the car analogy (it was an analogy used by one of my Buddhist teachers for the record πŸ˜‰ ). I recognise that the perception of rudeness is my own, and as such do not allow it to effect me in this moment, but felt that, in the interests of trying to keep the discussion friendly on the forums for everyone, Stephen should have it pointed out to him that what he is saying can be construed that way, so that he can realise that this forum is not like others he may have been on (he mentioned "Christian Channels" in his first post on this thread), and that people here want to discuss things in a friendly manner and there is no need for such defensiveness and certainly no place for accusing someone of being a liar without sufficient justifcation.

I don't think it was the car post that Stephen had issue with, perhaps more the posts that followed that perhaps challenge his own beliefs or understandings.

Not offended no, just recognising what is being said and how people will perceive it. If it were not pointed out that calling someone a liar is rude, then others would come to the forums expecting they can go around making such accusations or name-calling of others, and that doesn't fit in with the forum guidelines in respect of friendly discussion.

Not completely, as I feel it relates to people's feelings towards others of different faiths.

Yes.

Alright, thanks for the explanation. πŸ˜‰

I don't think it was the car post that Stephen had issue with, perhaps more the posts that followed that perhaps challenge his own beliefs or understandings.

I meant, to Stephen, from Stephen's perspective - your posts were THE CAR (that's how it looks from my perspective :D)

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